Wednesday Morning Rockpile:
Yesterday's complete game may satiate Ubaldo Jimenez for awhile, but he's probably still starving to accomplish a shutout. The improvement he's made each month, however, is much more important. Just take a look:
| G | GS | W | L | CG | SHO | IP | H | R | ER | HR | BB | K | ERA | |
| April | 6 | 6 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 29 | 34 | 23 | 19 | 2 | 22 | 23 | 5.90 |
| May | 5 | 5 | 0 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 29.2 | 33 | 17 | 16 | 1 | 11 | 25 | 4.85 |
| June | 6 | 6 | 1 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 35 | 31 | 16 | 14 | 2 | 18 | 27 | 3.60 |
| July | 5 | 5 | 4 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 35.1 | 24 | 8 | 8 | 3 | 14 | 27 | 2.04 |
As Clint Hurdle remarked, "He's growing up right before your eyes." It's unfortunate, though, that Jimenez can't grow another one of himself for Tuesday since it's a distinct possiblity that Kip Wells may, gulp, make that start against his old team, the Pirates. But if Ian Stewart brings his hot bat on the road with him, that will make things easier.
Woody Paige has no small task for Dealin' Dan: trade 10 players in order to keep Matt Holliday.One of those 10 players is Brian Fuentes, who's asking price has made teams shy away. Apparently, the Rockies are asking for Wade Hellickson from the Rays. I guess the Rockies are asking the Rays to do some surgery on Wade Davis and Jeremy Hellickson in order to combine them into one player.
Josh Fogg was hit in the face by a Joey Votto line drive during BP and received 30 stitches. He's still scheduled to start on Friday, for now.
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Why Woody Paige is a waste of ink:
from his own article today:
Todd Helton ($16.6 mil). Helton must be sacrificed for Holliday. The total in contracts is $40,750,000. (The pro rata share for the rest of the season is approximately $13.6 mil.) With the money saved this year and next, the Rockies could give Holliday a market-value, six-year, $150 million contract. End of story.
Then at the end:
Helton is The Big If. He’s beloved. He’s a special talent with the bat and the glove. He’s a very good man and has meant so much to Denver and the Rockies. But he will be 35 next month and is signed through 2011 with a contract that the Rockies would have to eat much of in order to move him.
Um…how can he be moved to save money, if the Rockies will still have to eat his contract? That makes no sense to even a crappy editor/
More Rock Pile: Sam Adams of the RMN wonders if Shawn Chacon would be a good fit for the Rockies and their need for a Starting Pitcher. I actually like Shak. Yeah, yeah, he sucked with the Astros, and has temperament issues, but I think we would be an upgrade over Kip Wells. Hell, I think Josh Fogg broken lip and all would be an upgrade over Kip Wells. Nolan Ryan said he would pitch again, if someone offered him a contract like Roger Clemens got. Clemens is available….
And lastly from Drew at the RMN:
Thought Clint Hurdle should be fired before it was cool.
by Redhawk on
Jul 23, 2008 10:28 AM MDT
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I saw that cartoon in the paper at work this morning
It definitely got a snort out of me.
Free Casey Weathers!!!!
by Silverblood on
Jul 23, 2008 4:46 PM MDT
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I guess no combination of...
Hirsh/Morales/Reynolds is better than Wells?
by Since1993 on
Jul 23, 2008 10:37 AM MDT
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Why Those 3 aren't mentioned
Morales last ten games:
Last 10 Games: (Current team only)
Date OPP W L ERA SV IP H ER BB SO
May 27 @SLC 1 0 4.26 0 6.1 5 3 1 3
Jun 01 SAC 1 0 0.00 0 6.2 2 0 5 5
Jun 07 SLC 0 0 9.00 0 4.0 7 4 4 2
Jun 12 @FRE 1 0 2.57 0 7.0 5 2 3 3
Jun 17 SLC 0 0 3.60 0 5.0 8 2 3 5
Jun 22 FRE 1 0 3.00 0 6.0 8 2 2 4
Jun 28 @POR 0 1 10.13 0 5.1 8 6 5 3
Jul 03 @TAC 1 0 2.70 0 6.2 4 2 4 4
Jul 09 @SAC 0 1 24.75 0 4.0 8 11 4 7
Jul 20 @POR 0 0 3.60 0 5.0 3 2 5 4
Totals 5 2 5.46 0 56.0 58 34 36 40
Lots and lots of runs allow there
Hirsh:
Last 10 Games: (Current team only)
Date OPP W L ERA SV IP H ER BB SO
May 30 @SLC 0 0 3.00 0 3.0 3 1 5 1
Jun 05 SLC 0 0 8.31 0 4.1 5 4 2 6
Jun 10 @FRE 0 0 0.00 0 5.0 2 0 4 3
Jun 15 @TUC 0 0 6.00 0 6.0 6 4 3 2
Jun 20 SLC 0 1 9.00 0 6.0 9 6 2 1
Jun 26 @POR 0 1 6.23 0 4.1 5 3 4 5
Jul 01 @TAC 1 0 1.50 0 6.0 5 1 1 2
Jul 07 @SAC 1 0 1.80 0 5.0 2 1 7 4
Jul 12 FRE 0 0 4.50 0 6.0 7 3 3 3
Jul 18 @POR 0 0 11.25 0 4.0 7 5 5 0
Totals 2 2 5.07 0 49.2 51 28 36 27
Lots of walks, with out any strike outs
Reynolds last 2 games (since being sent down)
Jul 10 @SAC 0 0 1.50 0 6.0 8 1 2 8
Jul 22 NOZ 0 0 1.80 0 5.0 2 1 2 1
Reynolds needs an out pitch (hopefully a sinker or a splitter). He needs to learn this at AAA. BUT….the Rockies are really hurting for a SP.
All 3 can hopefully be salvaged. I’m not sure they are MLB ready quality. Granted neither is Kip Wells, but there isn’t a loss if a guy with his experience is ruined, but there would be if Hirsh/Morales/Reynolds came back to the bigs, and got shelled.
Thought Clint Hurdle should be fired before it was cool.
by Redhawk on
Jul 23, 2008 11:05 AM MDT
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Give Hirsh a chance to fail
Morales & Reynolds have already done so. It’s Hirsh’s turn.
He’s pitched in the big leagues for 2 teams over 2 years. He’s not a young rookie who’ll be ruined at this point. ABW—anyone but Wells.
There is a bright side to the '08 season.
Barry Bonds & Roger Clemens are out of baseball.
by maris61 on
Jul 23, 2008 11:52 AM MDT
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I agree with this
Unless Hirsh is still rehabbing, which I don’t think he is.
by Since1993 on
Jul 23, 2008 4:00 PM MDT
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Great Link
Thanks! I was glad to see that there is still hope for Hirsh and Morales.
Thought Clint Hurdle should be fired before it was cool.
by Redhawk on
Jul 23, 2008 4:22 PM MDT
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Scout on Chacin
from BP (its free this week):
“He’s almost a poor man’s Felix Hernandez for me—emphasis on poor man’s,” explained the scout. “It’s a Felix kinda body—but he’s a little shorter and not as imposing, and it’s not Felix’s stuff—everything is a grade or two below.” While the scout was impressed with Chacin’s broad arsenal and thought he could pitch in Double-A right now, he didn’t see him as truly elite. “He throws with some effort, but he’s athletic and I think he’ll be fine,” said the scout. “The fastball is a tick above average, but he throws three or four other pitches, and he throws them all for strikes—he cuts the fastball, has a changeup and two breaking balls, and while they’re all good, I’m not sure which is a knockout pitch.” He also had one more trait that the scout likened to King Felix, and it’s not a good one. “He pitches away from contact far too much, just like Felix does,” said the scout. “Basically, you hit his fastball and you won’t see it again, and he’ll start dinking and ducking with the secondary stuff.”
Second half run?
by moomacher on
Jul 23, 2008 11:21 AM MDT
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it’s actually kind of refreshing to read a report that’s not too glowing on chacin. even though i love chacin prematurely.
by onholliday on
Jul 23, 2008 8:12 PM MDT
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Tim Brown at Yahoo Sports
Had this to say yesterday:
At the same time, more than one organization was rooting hard this week for the Los Angeles Dodgers, who, with a sweep in Colorado, might have convinced the Rockies to part more easily with Holliday, their left fielder, and/or Fuentes, their closer.That could be a hard sell. The Rockies are seven games back of first place in the NL West. A year ago today they were 5½ back, and seven back on Sept. 10. And, a year ago today, one general manager recalled wryly, the Rockies were hustling Garrett Atkins and Todd Helton, and ultimately were pleased no one bit.
Still, said one GM, "Everything depends on Colorado."
Not sure what I think about all that.
The rest of article on trades and potential trades is here.
Put me out of my misery. Please!
by rockhead on
Jul 23, 2008 1:14 PM MDT
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I say...
No sense in the Rox selling low at any point. I’m much happier taking the draft picks than marking down Fuentes to a “reasonable” price.
by Since1993 on
Jul 23, 2008 3:59 PM MDT
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Be careful what you wish for
draft picks are actually the undesired result for a number of reasons:
1. Arbitration is not a guarantee-
Fuentes wants to close and so long as he’s in Colorado he probably will. What happens when Fuentes reaches the early free agent period, notices that people aren’t coming close to match his desires of money and opportunity, and then sees that Colorado could pay him 8-10 mil for one year as their closer? Having Fuentes around isn’t a bad thing, but at that price it would be. Say good bye to some of the Holliday budget, or starter upgrade budget. Fuentes accepting arbitration is a potential problem.
2. Draft picks are likely to be 2-3 years further away than acquired assets-
Even if you trade for the equivalent of two top fifty dradft picks, you are likely getting them from Double A, where they’ve already made two performance leaps from low A to High A, then High A to AA. It’s easier to foresee their impact, and their impact could come rather quickly. For a team looking at contending for the next couple of years, that should be high priority.
3. The Rockies are simply lousy with picks in this range-
For a team with a fairly fruitful farm system, their selections between the sup first and second round have not been good of late. From 2004, a quick look:
‘04 2nd, Seth Smith- Seth has been a borderline organizational top ten for a few seasons, but the power has never arrived, and at 25 going on 26, the future looks like fourth outfielder.
‘05 sup 1st, Chaz Roe- Still plenty of talent here, but never took the big leap in stuff, and slightly above average fastball makes him a likely 3-5th starter, 5th being the more likely scenario. Really getting bombed lately after a decent start.
‘05 2nd, Zach Simons- Bombed as a starter, slightly better in relief, moved for Grilli. Getting Grilli has been good, but trading Fuentes for two future Grilli’s doesn’t seem like the same bang for your buck.
‘05 2nd, Daniel Carte- Strictly average in Tulsa, with little hope for a shot as a fourth outfielder. No special tool other than playing the game hard. Time will probably run out before the Rockies are willing to take a look.
‘06 2nd, Daniel Christensen- So far, the biggest flop, as Christensen has a serious allergy to contact. Has shown flashes over the last two months, but flashes aren’t enough to make him a prospect.
‘07 2nd, Brian Rike- Suffers from same allergy as Christensen, and Rike’s power isn’t showing up consistently enough (only 7 doubles?). Still has interesting tools, but knowing what we know now, he looks more like a fifth rounder than a second rounder.
‘08 2nd, Charlie Blackmon- Obviously jury’s out, but I’m not a fan of the profile of a 2 year old outfield convert. Beyond average, his current rookie ball campaign can’t be considered successful at his age. Still, probably pointless to judge before trying Asheville, but can we not get a home run before the year’s out Charlie?
There are a couple of trends you can spot in the players above, but the one I want to stress is that none of these guys were really considered guys that slipped to these spots, but maybe guys that Colorado may have reached on. With little proof that the Rockies are willing to spend more money on two additional draft picks, I don’t believe giving Colorado these picks can be seen as getting two of the top fifty players in next year’s draft.
That last reason is probably why I’m not liking the appearance of the Rockies floating high prices on these guys. I’m not sure of the truth behind the rumor, but it’s nonetheless an embarassing notion that Clay Buccholz was requested for Fuentes. Unreasonably high demands cost Bowden good years in Tampa, and Littlefield the same in Pittsburgh.
If there really is no equivalent to two draft picks out there in trade, than no Brian shouldn’t be dealt. But there’s no way that’s the case. If the Rockies remain stubborn and take Fuentes to arbitration at year’s end, I will still consider this a failure on their part for not finding an avenue to put the club in a better situation in the near future.
A quality trade is out there, and I do expect we’ll find it. If not, we still have a new bushel of aspiring fifth outfielders to look forward to…
by David OhNo on
Jul 23, 2008 8:54 PM MDT
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Sure, use history!
And , no, unless Theo Epstein’s picked up a dangerous taste for heroin, we wouldn’t see Clay Bucholz coming west for Fuentes. I am saying that come the witching hour, if all Dealin’ Dan can get his hands on for Fuentes is two tickets to the Boulder Dinner Theatre, first-in-line rights at Sniagrab and a sixer of Fat Tire, he just says no and takes the picks – given that he could waste them. I just don’t want an “all I could get” deal forced on him as a result of the Rauch trade or Pittsburgh losing a game of chicken for Nady or Bay.
by Since1993 on
Jul 23, 2008 10:16 PM MDT
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I didn't say "take what you can get."
All I’m saying is that if the best offer is just the equivalent of two top fifty picks, you still have to take it.
by David OhNo on
Jul 23, 2008 10:23 PM MDT
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Epstein and his dangerous taste for heroin
I’m working on it. Clay Buchholz is as good as ours.
by Tom (RFTN) on
Jul 23, 2008 11:04 PM MDT
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I called London...
They’re driving Amy Winehouse to Heathrow right now…
by Since1993 on
Jul 23, 2008 11:15 PM MDT
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Holliday Dilemma
I whole heartening disagree with Woody’s comments. Now is the time to deal Holliday especially fresh off his All Star blast and his recent hot streak. Why trade our hottest property? One reason would be Todd Helton. Helton, who is currently 35, and signed through 2011 makes up almost 25% of the current Rockies payroll. Holliday who is 28 wants a six year deal. If you look at Helton’s statistics, he peaked during the 2000 – 2001 years, when he was…27!
Baseball research has shown that players tend to peak in their late 20s. Signing Holliday now to a long term contact is not baseball smart. Sure he would still produce for the next 2 – 3 years but then steadily decline to what Helton has become. A longtime Rocky whose time has passed. The Roxs don’t need more salary anchors.
From a fan (and heart’s) standpoint watching a player become a star in your own backyard is great but what would Denver rather have? A star (like Helton) or a World Series title. Today’s free agency has killed the one player, one team concept. Loyalty to a team is has tenous has a summer afternoon rain shower in Denver. World Series titles are won by complete teams.
Due to the Boras Factor, I don’t think Holliday has ever become a true fan favorite. His comments over the years have never tended to indicate that his preference is to stay here. Why doesn’t Holliday have a chant like Tulo? Holliday has never embraced the city. Fans like characters and a little personality. Holliday is a nice guy but I think most people in Colorado knew long ago that he wasn’t a long term guy.
In the end, Colorado baseball fans should embrace the small market mentality and root for the team, not its players. To win in today’s baseball market it is all about talent. Teams like the Rockies can’t afford to make long term financial mistakes (i.e. Hampton and Helton) with their heart. Management needs to ride their young players (i.e. pre free agents) to a playoff or World Series title and then sell to rebuild. Restock your farm and build to another title run. Sure it isn’t sexy, like the Yankees or Red Sox, but they can afford to pay their way to the playoffs each year and also can afford long term mistakes. Embrace the team not the players.
Finally think of what the Roxs could buy for $120 million over the next 6 years. Last year signaled the blue print to win at altitude. Build your starting pitching from within (no high end free agent pitcher will ever come here), rebuild a pitcher or two from the scrap heap, spend that Holliday money on a bullpen to die for because starter’s are only going to last 5 – 6 innings, and finally keep bringing up the youngsters who are hungry for free agent money (make sure they can play defense!). Who needs Holliday? Keep Atkins at 3B, Tulo at SS, Barmes at 2B, Baker at 1B. Let Stewart play everyday at LF, Fowler at CF,and Hawpe in RF.
Baseball is a team sport; big money stars rarely bring championships to their towns especially small market teams. Would you rather have World Series or Holliday memories?
by Purple Rox on
Jul 23, 2008 11:46 PM MDT
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I guess...
you haven’t seen those “Every Day is a Holliday” t-shirts. Or been to a game and seen all the #5 jerseys. No matter. Holliday has indicated his desire to stay several times. He’s not an idiot, though and he’ll want to be paid for his services.
I sort of remember a lot of “big money stars” from Reggie Jackson to Manny Ramirez winning championships. I’m not saying we should try to buy a ring like the ‘92-’93 Blue jays or ‘97 Marlins but look at the Yankees from ‘96 through 2000. They largely succeeded by keeping the talented team they built together and bore the costs to do so. I know were not the Yankees but I don’t want to be the A’s either, forever trading their stars for a haul of prospects and remaining “a few years away” every year.
Why would you play Stewart in LF and Atkins at 3rd if Atkins is a converted third baseman and Stew’s a natural third baseman?
What could the Rox buy for $120 million saved from trading Holliday? More Kip Wellses? More Luis Vizcainos? The Helton contract is obviously a few years too long but Holliday @ $120M/6yrs is not outrageous.
I’m not saying I would never trade Holliday but your reasoning seems flawed to me.
by Since1993 on
Jul 24, 2008 9:14 AM MDT
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I'm not perfect...
You have some good points but to clarify I really don’t think Holliday has been embraced by the fans. My wife thinks he is good looking but come on…who builds a team for looks! And by the way what is Holliday going to say with years left on his contract…trade me? Of course he is going to play the game and say all the right things but don’t think Boras isn’t in his ear telling him how to land a gazillion dollar per year contract.
What I meant by big stars is that very rarely do teams win with one outstanding star win championships. Manny had Pedro, Ortiz, Beckett, and what not. I would love to keep this team intact but the Monforts don’t have another 20 – 40 million dollars to spend to keep it together. What is wrong with the A’s.? They are competitive, they win, they are in the hunt year in and year out. Guess you need to decide do you like personalities (i.e. players) or your team. Like I said are you going to remember Holliday or a World Series title? If players had more commitment to a city I would definately want to keep our talent but they are all hired guns. Very little loyalty…
The only reason I would put Stewart in LF is that Atkins certainly isn’t going there!
I am sure that the money saved on Holliday could be put to good use. No more Kips or Vizcainos but real relief. In addition it would be nice to have the cash lying around to find that final piece in late July.
by Purple Rox on
Jul 24, 2008 9:58 PM MDT
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Holliday fan favorite...
I have to agree with your general premise, however I do find myself conflicted. Since the “Rocktober” run up and all of the fan fare, including the player bios on FSN over the winter, my wife has become a huge Holliday fan, and is starting to learn more about baseball. That has given me the liberty to watch the Rockies even more than I otherwise would, and even take her to games ( I would have gone anyway, but since we went together instead of me with the “boys”, it counts as “date night”- double bonus!!!) If Holliday is traded before she gains more of an appreciation of the game as a whole, I am afraid my new-found freedoms will leave town with him.
by Fos on
Jul 24, 2008 9:25 AM MDT
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Well, there you go...
Argument made.
by Since1993 on
Jul 24, 2008 10:43 AM MDT
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Fri's pitching change
“Josh Fogg was hit in the face by a Joey Votto line drive during BP and received 30 stitches. He’s still scheduled to start on Friday, for now.”
The Rockies official site’s been updated, Edinson Volquez moves up from Sat to Fri in Fogg’s place, if Josh’s lip heals before Sun (I kinda doubt it though) he might start Sun’s game.
Die-hard Rockies fan since 4-5-93 & 100% loyal to the Rox win or lose, they R my heart & soul.
"It's funny, Todd would be the guy jumpin' around and Tulo would be the guy tryin' to calm everybody down." -Jeff Francis
by Rocktober 2007 on
Jul 24, 2008 1:38 AM MDT
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