Florida Marlins @ Colorado Rockies GameThread, Jul 3, 2008 6:05 PM MDT

Senor Fail is in. I just think he annually goes to hell and each time we need to have someone ready to replace him. Last year it was Manny. This year it’s Bucky, I guess.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:29 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

And Yorvit FAIL. Why is this the most predictable yet also the most painful thing in the world? At least Bucky doesn’t get the loss, but I could kind of see that coming, since he hasn’t pitched in 1.32 years.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:29 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

When Jeff Baker

goes to donate blood, he declines the syringe, and instead requests a hand gun and a bucket.

by rosenthal on Jul 3, 2008 8:36 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

To take a shower

Jeff Baker rides a grizzly bear through an automatic carwash.

There are no such things as tornadoes. Jeff Baker just hates trailer parks.

Jeff Baker had to stop washing his clothes in the ocean. The tsunamis were killing people.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:38 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

When the Boogeyman goes to sleep every night he checks his closet for Jeff Baker

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:40 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jeff Baker

once challenged Lance Armstrong in a “Who has more testicles?” contest. Jeff Baker won by 5

by rosenthal on Jul 3, 2008 8:43 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Another thing I hate about Hurdlelogic

is the waste pitch on an 0-2 count!! Why not just go after the batter when you get him in a hole?

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 8:31 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

There are some other things I hate about Hurdlelogic

Like all of it. My dad refuses to watch the All-Star Game at all since the village idiot is managing, and I’m pretty close to joining him.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:34 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dang I forgot there's a DH

I was expecting see him let a pitcher bat in the bottom of an inning and the replace him at the top of the next inning.

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 8:35 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not bad, Fuentes.

There’s one tiny chip off my mountainous grudge toward you.

by dogs on Jul 3, 2008 8:35 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Senor Fail doesn't fail

It must be an accident. I’d like a Tulo walkoff homer, but I realize the odds of this are vanishingly small.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:35 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

We should

really motivate Fuentes. He succeeds, we get a better player in return.

by rosenthal on Jul 3, 2008 8:37 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

He can become

Senor Succeedsalot for us so we can get rid of him.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:39 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Let's have a walk-off

Crowd wants fireworks

by DeepPurple on Jul 3, 2008 8:36 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Leadoff walk.

Put it to good use.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 8:39 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Will Hurdle make Tulo bunt?

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 8:39 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well duh

What do you think?

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:40 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Noooooooo

I hate this bunt here

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 8:39 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

So do I but

we all have come to know how Clint manages

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 8:40 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Bunt and

out at second.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 8:41 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Go Figure!!

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 8:41 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Hurdle wants bunt

Bunt fails.

Me = unsurprised.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:41 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

If you spell Jeff Baker in Scrabble, you win. Forever.

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:41 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Come on CDI!

Plz? Extra innings would be lame on fireworks night.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:42 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I was yelling at the TV....

NO, Clint, don’t bunt here!

Why PR with Pods if you don’t do a hit and run, or let him steal. Giving up outs is a Hurdle trademark.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 8:42 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

You are what you eat. Jeff Baker eats RBI’s

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:43 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Clint you IDIIOT.....

that’s what he should have done with Pods.

He’s small-balling us out of the inning.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 8:45 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

You sound

like my college girlfriend.

by rosenthal on Jul 3, 2008 8:46 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wow..you were that good huh?

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 8:46 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hmm...

Is your first name Clint? :>)

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 8:47 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jeff Baker can split the atom. With his bat

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:45 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Garg

I feel more fail.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:45 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Oh lord

Hurdle’s complete idiocy was on full display that inning. Not helped out by our standard-issue fail.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:46 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Hurdle

is a moron.

by DieHardRox on Jul 3, 2008 8:46 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Jeff Baker

should be a player/manager

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:47 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Lets play 22 tonight

see if anyone stays for fireworks then

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:49 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

We need another RBI

when is Baker up again?

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:52 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Torreabla demands a trade

to the Casper Ghosts

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 8:53 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Yorvit . . . sigh.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 8:53 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I have something in common with Torreabla

I want him to be traded too

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:54 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I

would like to see some stats on how often Hurdle giving up outs results in runs.

by DieHardRox on Jul 3, 2008 8:55 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

NO BUNT NO BUNT NO BUNT

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 8:57 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Seconded

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:57 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

you beat me to it...Here comes another bunt!

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 8:57 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's the only thing Hurdle

knows how to do with a runner on first.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:58 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Leadoff walk again

Can this please end better than last time?

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:57 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Here comes the bunt.....

from a .320 hitter.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 8:58 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Makes you hate MensaHurdle even more, huh?

Especially considering Barmes has a pair of hits tonight.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 8:59 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

why in the hell

is Barmes bunting?

Oh yeah….Hurdle

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 8:59 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Hurdle leads

the NL every year in SH attempts by non-pitchers.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:00 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

But we can't fire Hurdle

“that’s just not productive”

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:00 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

well he can't bunt now with 2 strikes

by jimmyski on Jul 3, 2008 9:01 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

If Barmes is saved from bunting

by Miller’s inability to throw strikes, you know Holliday’s gonna be up there trying.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:01 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Christ

this is the worst AB ever

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:01 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

.......

.........

....................

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:01 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

FIRE HURDLE NOW

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:01 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Hurdle will never be fired.....

Trust me on this one. Monforts love him to death.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:03 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh I know

That won’t stop me from asking for it.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:03 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

and me wishing it

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:04 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

That was awful.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:01 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Bunted at Ball Four!

It was outside, which is why he fouled it.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:02 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Listen all of y'all....

It’s a sabotage!

I hear that song everytime Hurdle makes one of these brilliant decisions.

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:02 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

jezzus H

Hurdle….you give up an out…and we see what would happen…...the Marlins would of course take the bat out of Holliday’s hands, cause the only run that matters is at 2nd (with the steal, not the Sac)

That is one of the worst coached games I’ve ever watched

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:03 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

The thing about watching the Rockies is

you see a doozer of unbelievable stupidity at least once a week, oftentimes more.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:04 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

And Spilly gets to 2B anyway with a steal

IBB to Matt. I smell fail coming, and my dad just remarked that you have to be brilliant to be as stupid as Clint is. Maybe he’s doing it on purpose.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:03 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

This Fox All Star game commercial

has both Holliday and Atkins in it…I wonder if they tailor it to each market

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:04 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I wonder if Hurdle.....

will have Chase Utley bunting if the leadoff All-Star gets on base?

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:05 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Well, Hurdle

will want to play to win so he can get home field advantage in the playoffs for the Rockies.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:06 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

LOL

he’s delusional, then.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:06 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Have we

ever doubted that?

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:07 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes

of course

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:06 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Amazing

Hurdle makes some of the most painfully stupid managerial decisions and then tells the paying customers to stay home if they don’t like how the team is doing, yet ownership loves him like he’s their own son.

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:05 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I've seen Hurdle make bad decisions

but having Barmes bunt there….was just stupid. Has Hurdle ever watched a baseball game?

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:05 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I dunno

Whatever he’s doing in the dugout, it isn’t watching and/or thinking and/or learning anything.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:06 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

epic fail

the Rockies deserve to lose this game

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:07 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Baker Time

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:07 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Jeff

and there’s Star Wars mucis playing. Do it.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:07 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Sometimes I think we are underachieving

Then I realize we’re just bad.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:07 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Acceptance

stage 5

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:09 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jeff Baker knows what Bo doesn't

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:08 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Robbed

Crap.

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:08 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Boo.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:08 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

CRAP

what a play by Helms. I thought that was through the hole

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:08 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

EPIC EPIC FAIL

I’ve seen enough. I’ll see how the Marlins win …. er, game turns out later.

Curse you Helms.

We are all dead.

by Silverblood on Jul 3, 2008 9:09 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Nobody

will ask Hurdle after the game press conference about his strategy.

by DieHardRox on Jul 3, 2008 9:10 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Because he has no strategy?

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:11 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's worse than the White House

press corp. Totally deferrential to the dear leader.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:12 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

CLINT!...CLINT

Redhawk with the Purple Row….um we want to know when you ever had a bunt attempt by a position player and give up an out that ever worked out.

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:13 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

hmmm

why does the Denver media suck so much…

P.S. I’ve emailed Renck before when I feel like his recaps are missing the point…and he has responded, so I suggest dropping him a line if the Rockies lose and he doesn’t bring up the bunts.

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:15 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

But I don't think

I could write a letter about Hurdle with out me sounding like a raving maniac.

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:21 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Media...

I’m not being facetious, I’m honestly asking. Do the media in other baseball towns ask this kind of question? I’m sure not every city is the same, but is the Denver press in the minority in this respect? I don’t know the answer, but I can’t imagine there aren’t other places that are much the same.

by holly96 on Jul 3, 2008 9:20 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Minority? um don't know

Of the markets I know enough to have read the papers and listen to the radio during baseball season,

Chicago and St. Louis are BRUTAL. Miami actually was more direct than Denver. Seattle, and Minneapolis, and Dallas….where like Denver.

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:25 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks

I don’t actually have much to go on other than Denver. I lived in Utah during college, but the Jazz are the only team there and I avoided them like the plague. Though they’re fairly tough on the college teams. I avoid most stuff out here in SF, too, though over the years I’ve caught enough to know that they’re probably a little tougher than Denver, but probably not close to Chicago and St. Louis that you mentioned.

by holly96 on Jul 3, 2008 9:30 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

In both Chicago and St. Louis

the media will ask about “why did you throw a certain pitch, in that situation” type questions.

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:33 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's a tough gig

You can’t, realistically, rip on the team, particularly in a game story. You can’t ask the really tough, dickish questions (like Dino Costa), because you’ll alienate yourself from a team you’re covering 200 days a year.

I think Renck does a marvelous job. Obviously Ringolsby does as well.

by rosenthal on Jul 3, 2008 9:28 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hitting the batter.

Just what needed to happen.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:12 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Funny how....

Florida didn’t try to bunt when their leadoff hitter got on base, and they ended up scoring a run. Hurdle is mystified.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:18 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, that sucks.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:18 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

no, no, no Hurdle

don’t walk him…...Don’t give em more runners. Geeze Hurdle you do that when you are on the road, and the runner doesn’t matter

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:19 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Hurdle may not

be on the road, but he is out to lunch.

by DieHardRox on Jul 3, 2008 9:21 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Way to thrill the sellout crowd

if we came back to win. If we lose, what a blown opportunity to thrill the fans.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:24 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I hope you guys are ready for antoher bunt

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:24 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

NO BUNTS, CLINT!!!

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:25 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Leadoff man on

It’s buntin’ time!

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:25 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Torry is too slow to score from 2nd

if the SH works, followed by a single.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:25 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

showed Bunt

again….gawd damn Hurdle….you are really trying to push this

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:26 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Bunty McBunt

calls for another bunt.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:26 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Now Clint will think he's smart....

what a lucky SOB.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:26 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

More Bunts for YOU!

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:27 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure,

it worked out, but not due to Hurdle.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:26 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Dumb luck

Hurdle’s favorite kind.

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:27 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Might as well

put a bunt down now. Maybe it’ll surprise the Marlins.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:28 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

bases loaded

Q

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:28 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

no outs

bases loaded…..

Time for a squeeze bunt!

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:28 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Bases loaded, no outs

The Rockies have come up empty time and time and time again in this situation this season.

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:29 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

If the Rockies win

it’s a game they don’t deserve to. At the least, it shouldn’t really count towards Hurdle’s career record.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:30 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Q

try not to swing at pitches in your eyes

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:31 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Q

RISP failures continue.

Hurdle’s thinking, “Should have had him bunt.”

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:34 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

And we would

have seen a tiple play.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:34 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

triple*

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:35 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nipple play?

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:35 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Damn it hurdle

Squeeze….it’s Pods at 3rd

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:36 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Spilly!!

Wins it!!

by Clockwork Orange on Jul 3, 2008 9:36 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Spilly

walk off!

please play more thx

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:36 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

A win!

But that was way too tough.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:37 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Rockies Win

Hurdle thinks he’s a great baseball Manager!

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:37 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Hurdle is a genius

firing him would be unproductive.

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:38 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Translation from Monfort-eese to real world English:

Fire Hurdle…than I have to pay him to NOT manager, and some one else to manage….why would I do that? I don’t care about winning baseball…..I care about not losing money

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 3, 2008 9:41 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm still hoping for some

gaffe during the all star game that the national media rips Hurdle about

The 2008 Rockies: All loses, all season

by moomacher on Jul 3, 2008 9:46 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Guy puts down a bunt,

but after contact with the bat the ball goes straight into the hitter’s nose.

"Keep your head down, and inch toward daylight." - Blade of Tyshalle

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Jul 3, 2008 9:48 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was hoping for that in the World Series....

as long as it wouldn’t cost us a win.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:48 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

And Hurdle would have played Taveras

instead of Spilly if he were healthy, thus preventing that game winning hit!

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:38 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Damn...

I missed a walk-off. That’s what I get for not having faith in my team in the late innings.

by dogs on Jul 3, 2008 9:50 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Press Conference....

Someone said “I guess this is what you can do with execution of the sacrifice bunt”....

Hurdle said, “Third time was the charm”. Laughter among the lapdog press followed.

Barf.

by GoRoxGo on Jul 3, 2008 9:50 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I've come to a conclusion...

After reading this game thread, I’ve surmised that there are a lot of people in here who really don’t understand the game of baseball as well as they think they do if they’re killing Hurdle over the decisions to sac bunt late. I mean, seriously. If you have the winning run on base with nobody out and you’re the home team, you bunt him to scoring position. That’s baseball 101. This thread is a clear sign that you all have completely lost your freaking minds when it comes to the Hurdle-hating around here, and Exhibit A why I don’t participate in the game threads anymore.

If Tulo succeeds on that bunt in the 9th and we win the game, it’s great execution. He doesn’t… and Clint Hurdle is an idiot.

Are you people really that crazy? Are you really that blinded by hate for Hurdle, who (frankly) hasn’t done anything to deserve this level of animosity? That’s really sad. I’m sure glad I can enjoy a Rockies game, win or lose, without ascribing everything that goes wrong over the course of nine innings to the manager.

“Stupid Hurdle… why didn’t he wave his magic wand and make Tulo bunt better. And why did he tell Herges to hang that curveball? What an idiot.”

Next time you call Hurdle an idiot for something completely out of his control, do us a favor, walk away from your computer, and look in the damn mirror. Maybe then you can enjoy a win every now and then.

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 3, 2008 11:17 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm not going

to throw you over the fire, probably because you don’t deserve it (though you might).

Bunting is almost always stupid. Like… Really stupid. You know that kid in your kindergarten class who ate crayons (might have been you, not sure)? It’s as stupid as that kid… If that kid were fed paint chips as a child.

It’s late and I don’t have the access to the numbers. I’m sure Rox Girl does, and I’m sure she can do a better job of explaining it to you than I can, but the numbers reallllllllly don’t support sacrifice bunts, particularly coming from a position player who has a history of hitting the ball fairly well.

A manager’s job is to, essentially, play the odds. And Clint Hurdle, for whatever reason, has gone against the odds an alarmingly high number of times. This is a man who put Jamey Carroll in to play 3B in close games. This is a man who plays Clint Barmes. This is a man who starts Yorvit Torrealba. This is a man who gave me a D- for using the f-word 12 times in a college paper…. (whoops… That wasn’t Hurdle. That was my poli sci professor. Moving along).

He’s probably a very nice guy. But he isn’t a good manager.

Plus…. He has a freaking soul patch. You can’t trust a man with a freaking soul patch.

by rosenthal on Jul 3, 2008 11:52 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

amen on the soul patch

by onholliday on Jul 3, 2008 11:53 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

With respect

I’m as sabermetrically inclined as the next guy. Honest. I’ve got the Baseball Prospectus subscription to prove it. And I fully understand and support the theory that it’s rarely a good idea to give away outs. Remember when we used to have Barmes and Sullivan at the top of our order, and whenever Barmes would get on in the FIRST FREAKING INNING to lead off a game, Sullivan would invariably bunt him over? That was stupid. Like, really stupid.

But when the number of outs you have left dwindles so dramatically – as it does in the 9th inning or in extra frames – there is absolutely nothing wrong with the sac bunt when the leadoff hitter reaches base. Now, obviously not everybody’s gonna bunt – they wouldn’t ask Holliday to bunt, I’m sure – but why the uproar about asking a .163 hitter to bunt in the ninth inning?

Bottom line – the bunt isn’t only NOT a bad play in the spot where the Rockies tried it tonight, it’s the RIGHT play.

Now I’m not here to say that I’m the President of the Clint Hurdle Fan Club. (Although – dude, if you are gonna dog Clint for playing Barmes, you probably should wait until he’s not hitting well over .300, and if you’re gonna dog Clint for playing Torrealba, maybe it’s fair to consider that Yorvit held an 8-game hitting streak coming into tonight and was coming off the best offensive game of his season last night.)

But I just think that not everything, when it comes to the performance of a team’s manager, is so black and white. You may not like Clint Hurdle, but that doesn’t make everything his fault. And that’s where I have the problem with the people who post on these game threads.

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 4, 2008 12:00 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Prime example

Witness the comment earlier tonight – apparently there was an 0-2 pitch at one point thrown by a Rockies pitcher that missed the strike zone. A poster decided to use that example as proof that Rockies pitchers rarely throw strikes on the 0-2 pitch, and cited that as an example of why Clint Hurdle is a crappy manager.

I mean… are you on crack cocaine???

I pitched in high school, and for a year in college, so I’m not claiming to be a pitching expert. But even from pitching at just that level, I know a few things. And one of the things that I know is that I would rather suffer a Chris Snyder-esque testicular injury than give up a hit on the 0-2 pitch. And I also know that I had coaches who, if I did give up a hit on an 0-2 pitch, would absolutely chew my ass once I got off the mound that half-inning. Put simply – you don’t want to give up a hit on an 0-2 pitch. And this is not a phenomenon unique to Rockies pitchers. Many pitchers choose to try and get a swing and a miss on a pitch well out of the strike zone on the 0-2 pitch. Others choose to throw one wide or high or low on an 0-2 to set up their best pitch on the 1-2 count. I believe Greg Maddux is going to the Hall of Fame because he made his career doing exactly that.

And when a Rockies pitcher does it, it’s because Clint Hurdle is an idiot.

Do you not see the absurdity there? Or is it just me.

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 4, 2008 12:07 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Barmes

I’m really amused by the fact that you are blasting Hurdle for playing Barmes, while a couple days ago at the beginning of a game thread, another poster (don’t remember who it was) in all seriousness decried Hurdle as an idiot for not playing Barmes. I don’t really have strong feelings one way or the other on this issue so I’m not saying who was right or who was wrong; I just find it funny that Hurdle can do keep Barmes out of the lineup and get blasted by one fan, and then put him in and get blasted by a different fan.

by holly96 on Jul 4, 2008 1:53 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wait a second

So when the number of outs goes down, you should waste them? Missed that economics lesson.

And Tulowitzki is a .163 hitter… This season. He’s a .300 hitter at home in his career. I’m guessing he’s a .000 hitter for his career when he attempts a sacrifice bunt. I’d also guess that he hasn’t sacrificed very much in his entire life.

It is pretty black and white to me. He shouldn’t have bunted. This is just one problem he’s made. Really not that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things (probably on par with his soul patch, really).

Clint Barmes is hitting better than .300…. this year. You know what else is .300 for Barmes? HIs career OBP. That’s pretty freaking pathetic.

Torrealba isn’t as good as CDI. It’s pretty simple. I think the scouts, seamheads and stat geeks would all agree that Chris deserves more playing time than Torrealba, by a considerable degree.

I don’t know what the hell the deal is with the count. Didn’t see the game, don’t really care what he does on a pitch-by-pitch basis. I suspect, though, that it’s not wise to intentionally throw a ball. A 1-2 count is one poor throw away from being a 2-2 count, which, again I’m just guessing here, has a much higher chance of yielding a hit than a 0-2. I also know that a 0-3 means the batter leaves the batter’s box.

If your coach told you to throw a ball (not sure if that’s the case here), you gotta do what your coach tells you… But I’d certainly question it a lot more.

And seriously…. A SOUL PATCH.

by rosenthal on Jul 4, 2008 12:13 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

It's less harmful to waste outs

And more helpful to get the winning run into scoring position, when it’s the 9th inning or later, even if it means you burn an out. Ask any manager who has ever coached at any level of this game and they’ll tell you the exact same thing I’m telling you. That’s a spot where you bunt, particularly when you’ve got a guy who has been in a year long slump and swung the bat like crap all night to that point at the plate. You’re free to disagree.

Iannetta has earned, and received, the bulk of the playing time this year. It took him a little longer to do that than it maybe should have. Is Hurdle at fault for that? Well, yeah, he draws up the lineup. Score one for the anti-Hurdle contingent. That’s fair. At least now he’s got the right guy in the starting role, and Torrealba is having to earn any additional playing time he gets (which, as long as we’re being fair, he has).

I’m done holding a grudge against Barmes, who was truly awful in 2006. This year he’s been our best option at 2B, and he’s hit more than enough this year to justify the playing time. (Although, you’ll note, he hasn’t been in there every day since coming off the DL, with Hurdle riding the hot hand in Baker at 2B. Wouldn’t that be classified as ‘good managing’ or is it against PR policy to give Hurdle any credit?)

And yes, I get it, the soul patch is stupid. So are Joe Maddon’s glasses, which he stole from Michael Douglas’s character in Falling Down.

I don’t mean to deny anybody the privilege of being anti-Hurdle. I’m just suggesting that if, just maybe, folks stopped to realize that not everything that goes wrong for the Rockies is his fault, we might raise the level of discourse here beyond ‘HURDLE IS STUPID OH NO KILL US NOW’ and ‘oh my God, we won… in spite of that MORON HURDLE’.

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 4, 2008 12:25 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

And re: the count

Trust me… sometimes there is a purpose behind throwing one or two out of the strike zone when you get way ahead of a hitter. I hate to sound like the kind of snob who says stuff like ‘If you played the game you’d understand’, particularly when I’m not exactly George Frazier when it comes to big league experience… but when it comes to pitching, I know what I’m talking about.

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 4, 2008 12:28 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I guess

we’ll just have to agree to disagree re: Hurdle. I think he’s among the game’s worst managers, but then again, I argue against using ‘closers’ in the 9th inning (I’d use my closer – my best reliever – in whatever situation was most necessary. Could be the 7th, 8th or 9th. And I’d always go for 2 in football…)

Also, Joe Maddon is awesome. He drinks wine after wins. And the glasses? I may or may not have worn a pair similar to them before. I plead the 5th.

I think the Rockies would be better off with a logical, math geek at the helm. But so could a lot of teams.

by rosenthal on Jul 4, 2008 12:33 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Next Rockies manager: Stephen Hawking?

I’d love to read his next book: “A Brief History of Clutch Hitting” if he were the guy to figure out how to make the Rockies do that more often.

I kid, I kid. I’ll grant that Hurdle does a lot of things that don’t exactly jive with the most rigid of sabermetric thinking. But I guess the crux of my argument is that the only difference between the 2008 Clint Hurdle who everybody here wants hanged and the 2007 Clint Hurdle who could have run for mayor of Denver after winning the pennant is the performance of his players, and I don’t believe that’s anywhere close to being entirely his fault. And as much as I hate to see my fellow Rockies fans miserable (because generally it’s a reflection of my own misery that I’m trying to suppress, with varying degrees of success the older I get), I really think Clint deserves a little more slack around here than he gets, and I just can’t figure out why he’s always the scapegoat for every little thing that the Rockies do that the PR community doesn’t like. I guess for now I’ll stop trying.

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 4, 2008 12:50 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

And

if you and I were sharing beers during that magical run, I would have pointed out that he got lucky and the only reason he was able to overcome his ‘overmanaging’ was that he had a roster of 40 players to roll through on any given night.

by rosenthal on Jul 4, 2008 12:55 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

i think hurdle is a horrible manager

i also know he didnt do anything wrong with bunting tonight. you could argue that barmes should of swung away but so what. the players didnt excute. i thought he was dumb for pulling bucky, i think bucky could of gone another inning and save fuentes for later. buckys arm was freash. hurdle is an idiot but didnt do all the much wrong tonite.

Scott Podsenik for center field 08

by roxfan4life on Jul 4, 2008 12:53 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Lost in all of this

Mark Redman was pretty good tonight. Tip of the cap to him – that’s a tough Florida lineup that punishes mistakes, and Mark really didn’t make any. I was sure we’d never see him in the bigs again after he was sent down but he looked like a different guy tonight, and even if he never pitches that well again this season or for this team, I gotta give him credit for giving the Rox just what they needed tonight.

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 4, 2008 12:54 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Friedrich

When does he start?

by rosenthal on Jul 4, 2008 12:59 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I missed a lively debate

first off….I think Hurdle is an idiot. That was even my sig line early in 07 I still think he’s an idiot.

Now was bunting a correct move in each of times he tried it last night? I don’t think so. Getting a runner into scoring position is good, and out of double play possibilities can be smart, but give up outs, and taking the bat out of hitters not so much (depending on the hitter of course), and if it works, the visiting team will just walk the next batter to set the DP back up, as the runner on first doesn’t matter, like they did to Holliday.

Barmes…when he came up, he had 2 hits already why take the bat out of his hands? When Pods came up there was already one out….bunting was away to avoid the DP, and with Pods’ speed the out isn’t automatic, but the tying runner was already in scoring position.

The bunt call can be the correct call…..but Hurdle uses it TOO much, and gives away too many outs, to the point it hurts the teams chances. Sometimes, you have to let your hitters hit, and do their jobs. In most cases, I’d rather have 3 batters hit with no outs and a runner on first, then 2 hitters hit with 1 out and a runner on 2nd. I’m sure their’s a math stat that backs this up.

I miss baseball. Can we fire Clint Hurdle and Dan O'Dowd now?

by Redhawk on Jul 4, 2008 8:52 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

It would be interesting

to hear Hurdle talk about his philosophy regarding the sac bunt. While I agree with most here that he uses this play all too much, I think there are rare instances when it can be a good strategy. The one out of three that worked was the only one that was good strategy, in my opinion. For all the times the tactic has failed, there are also times when Taveras and Pods are up when it is a good tactic, because of their speed, their ability to place the bunt, and the pressure they put on the fielders. We’ve seen them either beat the throw to first, or cause fielders to rush and make bad throws fairly often.

by jlikesrockies on Jul 4, 2008 9:19 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Sacrifice

Sacrificing is ALMOST ALWAYS a bad idea for the offense, and probably always has been. It most certainly has been since the end of the dead-ball era around 1920. Earnshaw Cook first demonstrated this in 1966(!) in his book "Percentage Baseball" (published by MIT Press, no less).

Back in the height (depth?) of the pitching-happy 60s, he proved that unless the batter has on OBP of less than .140, the better bet is to swing away IN ANY ON-BASE SITUATION. Given the enormous increase in offense since then, that number is much lower nowadays (I would estimate roughly .100 as the cutoff in 2008). So, unless the batter is the 2nd coming of Bob Buhl, making an out on purpose is a really, really bad idea.

It never ceases to amaze me how many "baseball people" seem to think that one of the problems with a team’s offense is that the team’s batters (esp. the pitchers) don’t know how to bunt. Actually, it is the exact opposite.

The managers who have figured this out have a significant advantage over those who have not. Joe Maddon’s Tampa Bay Rays have only 11 sacrifice hits all year, probably not unrelated to their surprising success. Conversely, Clint Hurdle’s Colorado Rockies have 47! (The idea of bunting in Coors Field is ludicrous beyond belief.) That means that, in less than half a season, the Rays have batted for 12 more innings (36 outs) than the Rockies. Makes a difference, no?

I remember a reporter asking Greg Maddux what kind of pitch he threw in a sacrifice situation (obviously expecting some sort of answer relating to making it hard to bunt). Maddux’ answer was (paraphrasing) "A strike down the middle — if they want to make outs, I will encourage them."

It probably never made a whole lot of sense to sacrifice, but ever since the days of Babe Ruth, it has made almost no sense.

They count two things in a baseball game — outs (3 per inning) and runs (team with the most wins the game). Since the game is over when you have used up all your outs, it makes sense to not give them away. Or, to put it another way, the most important single skill for an offensive player is the ability to NOT make outs.

by DieHardRox on Jul 4, 2008 9:39 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Counterpoint

Look, I’m not arguing your numbers. I’ve seen them myself. You don’t have to condescend to me about how important outs are.

I went back and re-read the chapter on the sac bunt in “Baseball Between the Numbers” and here’s what I found:

1. With a runner on first and no outs the odds of scoring in the inning are 41.7%. After a sac bunt (runner on second, one out), the odds do decrease – to 41.0%. So, yes, the bunt does drop the odds of scoring, but not in crippling fashion. Also consider that those probabilities are independent of things like who’s coming up to bat behind the bunter and who’s on the mound. I don’t mind Barmes moving a guy over to give Holliday and Atkins two chances to win the ball game with a single, particularly when the game is tied.

2. When a team is at home and the game is tied in the 9th inning (and presumably later, though the graph doesn’t go that far), playing for one run increases the win probability by 6%. That’s pretty significant, moreso (if you ask me) than the 0.7% decrease in scoring possibility (though, again, both numbers are theoretical and don’t take into account the entire context).

3. The one time the bunt worked for the Rockies last night was the time when it was the worst play. There is no defense for bunting when down a run in the home half of the ninth inning or later.

So, to conclude and sum up my thoughts: bunting when tied in the ninth or later = a fine piece of baseball strategy. Bunting on every other occasion = not a great piece of baseball strategy.

(Also, to compare totals of sac bunts by an NL team and an AL team is kinda like comparing apples to a big screen TV. NL teams will frequently have the pitcher bunt, which drives up their sac bunt total. AL teams don’t bat the pitcher – therefore, they won’t bunt as often.)

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.

by Franchise26 on Jul 4, 2008 10:10 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I

wasn’t trying to condescend. I apologize if you got that idea. I was just comparing the most with the least as far as SH. Part of this stems from the fact that when Hurdle took over this team one of his statements was “Now all the bunting BS will stop”. It seems we are in agreement that in most cases bunting is not a good thing.

by DieHardRox on Jul 4, 2008 10:32 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs