The Case for Managerial Change

by GoRoxGo on May 9, 2009 11:34 AM MDT Comment 21 comments

On the heels of Bob Melvin's firing, questions are increasing as to whether Clint Hurdle is on thin ice, and whether he's next to go among MLB's managers. I will simply look at the record in this post, and make the case for change....

First, a great place to look for Clint's record among his peers is here:

All-Time Manager Register

Clint Hurdle ranks 102nd all-time in games managed, all with the Rockies. However, he ranks 70th all-time in career worst winning percentage (.462), and he has the 2nd worst winning percentage among all currently active managers. Only Manny Acta of the Nationals has a worse record at .403 in 351 games.

Hurdle has also managed 1,141 games with the Rockies, and is 87 games below .500. He ranks 52nd all-time in games under .500, and NO active manager is more games under .500 in his career than Hurdle. Again, Acta is up there at -68 while Bruce Bochy is 60 games under .500, but he has done that in far more games, 2,278, and has a career .487 winning percentage.

So the record shows that Hurdle, compared to his peers, has managed a lot of games, been given a chance to lose a lot of games with one team, and is not showing that he can improve upon his record.

Now, ignoring the record, what do the Rockies have to lose by making a change? The team is playing inconsistently this year in a weak division that most felt was one we could contend in most of the season. It has not turned out that way. The main reason is the Rockies have performed poorly in the close contests, going 0-8 in one-run affairs.

How does a manager have anything to do with a poor record in close games? It's not measurable, but I believe that he's popular with his players who know that he's under the gun this year. I think these same players are trying too hard in the close and late game situations, at least subsconsiously trying to keep their manager from getting fired. They feel the pressure as much or more than Clint does. A managerial change could just help the team relax, go out and play baseball.

That relaxed mindset after the managerial change was the type of mindset the team had in mid-September 2007 when they appeared to be out of the NL West race, 6 1/2 games behind. Going out and playing loose, without anything hanging over their heads suchs as a manager's job, could help the Rockies get hot, as it did in '07. And with the Dodgers now vulnerable to returning to the pack in the next 2 months without Manny, this is the time to try to see if this season could be salvaged.

So, in sum, Hurdle has had his opportunity to lead this team, and in fact a longer stint than any managers with losing records have ever had with one team. You can find this truth on that link. His team is going nowhere right now, but has an opportunity to make noise if they get their heads (and a few bullpen arms) on straight. A managerial change can't hurt, and may very well help at this point in time, and I think the timing is right. What say you?

Eat. Drink. Be Merry. But the above FanPost does not necessarily reflect the attitudes, opinions, or views of Purple Row's staff (unless, of course, it's written by the staff [and even then, it still might not]).

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Hurdle should have been fired a long time ago.

Now, I’m not sure all of this mess is his fault. He can only do so much with what he’s been given, and I don’t think he’s been give much. The person responsible for providing Hurdle the players is O’Dowd. But O’Dowd is only so responsible for the players as he has to work within a very tight budget. The persons responsible for giving O’Dowd his budget are the ownership group led by the Monforts.

Personally I think it’s a WHOLE organizational problem. The Monforts could care less about winning. They want to make money, and they can do that far easier with a minimal budget. Fans show up to Coors Field in the summer cause it’s a beautiful place to be. The team on the field doesn’t matter at all. Why spend money to build a good minor league system (draft signings, minor league coaches, etc), Or getting key free agents (Kaz, then Orlando Hudson, Beimel, et. al) to still fall short of the Dodgers anyway?

Should Hurdle be fired…yeah, but that will be just wasting money. And the goal of this organization is not winning baseball, if it were, Hurdle would have been fired a long time ago. It’s about money, which is why Hurdle will be here till his contract is up. There is no reason to pay another manager money AND hurdle money to finish last.

And that is what is wrong with this organization. Winning is not the #1 priority, and until it is, they won’t every win. (basic stuff if you ask me)

(I woke up today really pissed off about this team)

by Redhawk on May 9, 2009 12:10 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

++++++++++1

You hit the nail on the head.

Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?
Author: Jim Bouton

by pedalpusher on May 9, 2009 1:29 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1000

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman
"Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun" - Ash from Army of Darkness
"H.I., you're young and you got your health, what you want with a job?" - Evelle from Raising Arizona
"It happens sometimes. People just explode. Natural causes." - Agent Rogersz from Repoman

by Broncoman on May 12, 2009 12:53 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

So who are you going replace him with?

First, it should be noted that this “case for managerial change” is made by the infamous Rockies-basher ROXPERT, masquerading under the name GoRoxGo. Roxpert went on the this same campaign years ago against Buddy Bell, even to the point of publishing the tiresome “Bell Chronicles.” What did that get him? Clint Hurdle.

I have yet to hear anyone come up with a viable answer as to WHO they would replace Clint Hurdle with as manager and why that individual would result in a longterm positive for the Rockies organization.

by DeepPurple on May 9, 2009 1:30 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Weiss or Castilla.

w/ Tracy and Baylor kept on as coaches.

These are the same core group of men that went 21 - 1 to win the NL pennant. Never, ever, ever believe that MY TEAM is out of it.

by The Lodo Magic Man on May 9, 2009 1:38 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

any time a manager/coaching change

is ever brought up in any sport, some one says “who do you want” . Like the fans know all the minor league and bench coaches in baseball, and know which ones are good. I’m a graduate of OU. I knew years ago they should fire John Blake. I had never heard of Bob Stoops. Turns out….Stoops wasn’t bad.

As for Hurdle, same thing. I’m sure some where, out there…..is a better manager for this club. Also there is a better GM.

Or…we can stick with the status quo. Which sucks by the way

by Redhawk on May 9, 2009 2:41 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agree with you but

who in our organization knows who or where those people are? The Monforts surely don’t.

Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?
Author: Jim Bouton

by pedalpusher on May 9, 2009 2:45 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

WolfMarauder indirectly answers this question in his recent fanpost

"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein

by Andrew T. Fisher on May 9, 2009 2:54 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

NO viable answer?!?

The idea that “no viable answer” has been suggested by anyone as to a successor for Mr. Hurdle as manager presupposes that Hurdle is hard to replace. Yeah, a guy who has managed over 1,100 games to a .462 winning percentage and one winning team in 8 years is indispensable. I see your point. (not)

I think we all could come up with plenty of names of highly qualified people to take over for Hurdle, many of whom would improve this team’s performance. We even may have someone on the bench who would work.

by GoRoxGo on May 9, 2009 4:18 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Grady Little.

Matt Murton status: Freed
Garrett Atkins status: Not Traded
Clint Hurdle status: Still Employed by the Rockies

by Andrew Martin on May 10, 2009 2:16 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Anyone

Your logic astounds me, there really is no one better, really, no one, no one could manage this team to the celler in the NL West. The dude laid out why he should be fired and your only defense is he doesn’t have someone lined up. You want a name, how about Cito Gaston, or does actually winning a couple of World Series disqualify you from being a coach of the biggest bunch of under achievers in baseball.

by Broncoman on May 12, 2009 12:51 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Funny story how Gaston is already employed

but hey keep trolling

Matt Murton status: Freed
Garrett Atkins status: Not Traded
Clint Hurdle status: Still Employed by the Rockies

by Andrew Martin on May 12, 2009 6:13 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't know

if we should fire Hurdle, demote him, hire a new manager, or what. I just know that if we would have won all of these 1-run ballgames instead of losing them, we’d be at 19-9. Even if we had won half of them, we’d still be two games over .500 at 15-13. In my mind, managerial expertise definitely shows up in your 1-run game differential – managers who can make the moves necessary to win don’t often lose every single close contest.

I’m not taking sides in the managerial debate, but I do know that that 0-8 figure needs to change and it needs to change soon. Right now we’re only two wins better than the Nationals.

"Admirably obsessive." - Uni Watch, March 24th, 2009
NA34 | HK | RMN

by oo_nrb on May 9, 2009 2:15 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Am I the only one that gets the feeling

That Hurdle is simply mailing it in here.

by mkorpal on May 9, 2009 2:23 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't think he's mailing it in.

I think he’s in over his head.

Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?
Author: Jim Bouton

by pedalpusher on May 9, 2009 2:34 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe he has spent too much time in the sun.

by mkorpal on May 9, 2009 2:41 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was going to post something here

But it ended up being really long, so I just threw it up as a blog post. Click over here, won’t you?

Staying on the sunny side of Blake Street since 1993.
The Shawn Chacon Experience - Life as a Rockies fan, one day at a time: Because we're all still recovering from those nine blown saves.

by Franchise26 on May 9, 2009 2:25 PM MDT reply actions 1 recs

EXCELLENT!!!

Now if we can just have a reason to have that press conference.

Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?
Author: Jim Bouton

by pedalpusher on May 9, 2009 2:39 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I approve wholeheartedly with this

Very well done.

"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein

by Andrew T. Fisher on May 9, 2009 2:53 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nicely done

Jim Zorn, 55. Sean Miller, 40. AJ Hinch, 34. Notice a pattern here?

by DbacksSkins on May 12, 2009 9:46 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

That relaxed mindset after the managerial change was the type of mindset the team had in mid-September 2007 when they appeared to be out of the NL West race, 6 1/2 games behind. Going out and playing loose, without anything hanging over their heads suchs as a manager’s job, could help the Rockies get hot, as it did in ’07. And with the Dodgers now vulnerable to returning to the pack in the next 2 months without Manny, this is the time to try to see if this season could be salvaged.

Do NOT use the 2007 run to define your expectations — that was a once in a lifetime deal. If you’re looking to that to happen again, you’re only going to be disappointed. Not only did the Rockies get hot, but they became one of the hottest teams in history over that time period. Hiring a new manager to get the players to “relax” is NOT going to replicate that.

Jim Zorn, 55. Sean Miller, 40. AJ Hinch, 34. Notice a pattern here?

by DbacksSkins on May 12, 2009 8:41 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs