San Francisco "name calling"
Best Game ever, Rockies Rule! (Just needed to say that).
I now live in the Bay area but have remain a Rockies fan and hope to get tickets to this Friday's game.
There is an old saying that you judge the greatness of a warrior (the Rockies) not by the number of his friends but the ferocity of their enemy. The Giants battled us tooth and claw for four games and deserve our respect. This is a team on the rise. Thanks Giants for a great fight. See you in three days.
Living in the Bay Area and an avid sports fan, I read the local newpapers and listen to the local sports radio on the way to and from work. This is the land of sad-sacks and sore-losers as far as the fanbase goes. The local media really feeds their pity party. The Giant's kool-aid gets pretty thick here.
The latest binge is that the Rockies cheat! Yes, the Rockies "as an organization" are cheaters.
Three examples, one that I can link to:
1. The Giants TV/Radio announcers began questioning the radar gun readings during Sunday's game, saying that the Rockies were purposely subtracting 4-5 miles per hour from Lincecum and not Jimenez. ( If they are, then it doesn't impact play, just gets into someone's head). They went on the draw a direct line to the humidor saying that the balls seem to have a little more life for the Rockies (even though the Giants out homered us this series 7 to 5) and questioned whether there shouldn't be an independent third party overseeing the process. If the Rockies are willing to mess with the radar gun, can they be trusted with the baseballs?
2. Dave Fleming, one of the Giant announcers, appeared on the Monday radio pregame for the Giant's flagship station. During the interview he reiterated the radar gun to humidor connection and went on, I will paraphrase, that the Rockies have a "history of being interested in this type of activity" but did not eloborate on what that history was beyond the radar gun and his unsubstantiated humidor accusation.
3. A popular Giants beat writer called it "gamesmanship" complaining about the same thing. He passes along an AZ beat reporter's reference to a PitchFX chart that shows a higher max and average velocity than his scientific reference to the "88-90" range of the Coors Field reading. He continues on in the next paragraph, as a continuation of the "natural" extension of the radar argument to infer, and again I paraphrase "if they will mess with the gun, makes you wonder about the humidor".
It is one thing for the fans to mouth off about conspiracy theories, but you expect the media to behave better and not spread unsubstantiated innuendo. I will be emailing Dave Fleming today to have him elaborate on the Rockies' history. He may have just been "giving a good interview" and did not really mean it.
Given the natural disadvantages that requires them to use a humidor, I would rather the Rockies not "mess" with the radar gun readings (if they are in fact doing it) or have Dinger standing behing the plate during the opposing pitcher's half inning. It is not only cheap but it leads to these types of connections being made.
Of course I also heard on the way into work this morning about Tulo's poor sportsmanship (calling out the ump about the insult to Yorvit), Apodaca being a cry baby (complaining about the everchanging strike zone) and Spilsborghs' insulting helmet toss "at the Giants as they tried to leave the field". Typical bitchin' after a tough loss.
As a team, I respect the Giants and don't count them out this year. We go into their house on this weekend for three more that may decide the season.
I expect alot of hoofin' about how the balls are the same for each team. And will watch the radar gun readings to see if they try to return the "favor" to Ubaldo.
We need to stay focused on the task at hand meaning beating the Dodgers and winning the division. But come Friday, expect some fireworks in the media and on the field!!
Eat. Drink. Be Merry. But the above FanPost does not necessarily reflect the attitudes, opinions, or views of Purple Row's staff (unless, of course, it's written by the staff [and even then, it still might not]).
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For my measly contribution...
…I will tear up all my Dave Fleming rookie cards.
Watching the purple row from high atop the big brown monolith on California Ave
by Mondogarage on Aug 25, 2009 1:01 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Hey, I live in the Bay Area, too.
Got tickets yesterday for Friday and Saturday. In the past I’ve gotten cheaper tickets through StubHub than through the official site, but this time the StubHub options were decidedly more expensive. I go by myself so I prefer not to risk the bleachers or upper decks, which means I had to shell out a pretty penny to make it to both games. Hopefully it will be worth it, though!
by holly96 on Aug 25, 2009 1:48 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
since you live in the Bay Area,
Have you heard the announcers etc. say those things?
by butterfly on Aug 25, 2009 1:56 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Other the one blog post that was posted last night, no.
But then I don’t listen much to the local talk radio or watch the local sports shows.
by holly96 on Aug 25, 2009 2:00 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
When is the handoff to umpires happening?
The last few years when rockies pitchers are doing well, this accusation seems to pop-up…
I am curious when do the umpires get the baseballs? Is at the beginning of each half of the inning (When Rockies can choose which balls to be given) or at the beginning of each inning or game (no way to cheat).
Has MLB even addressed this vicious rumour? shouldn’t it be easy to ensure that this cannot happen?
by Kumar_98 on Aug 25, 2009 1:57 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
One way to insure this doesn't happen
is to have an umpire handle each ball before it is put into play. Pitchers have said a lot about how different the balls “feel” when they’ve been stored in the humidor than they did before it was put into effect. If the balls were being switched back and forth several times during the games, an umpire really should be able to tell. Just having them control and handle the balls put into play would be a big stumbling block to those kind of games…
Oh wait, that’s exactly what happens….
by Junction Rox on Aug 25, 2009 2:20 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
This, so very much
Anyone who has played ANY sort of organized baseball can easily feel an odd baseball. Between the weight of the ball, the feeling of the surface, and the stitching, any professional umpire should be able to easily notice if some doctored baseballs were given to them.
They went on the draw a direct line to the humidor saying that the balls seem to have a little more life for the Rockies
How’s about this for an explanation? THE ROCKIES HITTERS ARE BETTER THAN THE GIANTS HITTERS!
Gladly sharing a name with Dexter Fowler!
by ShadowPenguin on Aug 25, 2009 2:26 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
the umpires should decide this issue in our favor. Tegardless of whether the ups actually test each ball, it seems beyond the pale to think that the umps would allow a team to manipulate the balls in play so effectively. pretty pathetic whining really.
as for the radar gun, that is probably dirty tricks and I hope we aren’t doing it. And Dinger should be banned from that lower section, if only because I don’t want to see him on TV.
by Teekalong on Aug 25, 2009 3:46 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice report on the happenings in SF
speed gun – I think this type of “doctoring” the in-house gun happens in every park because I’ve heard announcers say things like ‘the in-house gun is this, while the truck’s gun is this’ Best thing to do, if you are the visiting team, ignore the in-house gun!
humidor – I’m not sure on this, but doesn’t MLB regulate the humidor to prevent that type of activity from happening? You would think if the Giants believed they were doctoring the balls they would ask for an investigation.
Aku, Soku, Zan
by haj_saitou on Aug 25, 2009 2:03 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
I guess the next theory will be
that the Rox are making the fans do the wave while the other pitcher is pitching to cause a distraction!
Aku, Soku, Zan
by haj_saitou on Aug 25, 2009 2:05 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
That reminds me
I was at the game on Sunday and I thought I should share this story. It was top of the ninth, Rockies up 4-2, one out, Huston street pitching. Some a-holes behind me tried to start doing the wave, which luckily died off after a few sections. I am glad I wasn’t sitting behind them because I might have got in a fight.
President of the Don Draper fan club.
by jcd823 on Aug 26, 2009 12:21 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
the wave can be stopped
if we all work together
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by Andrew Martin on Aug 26, 2009 10:36 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
We need to circulate a petition to get it banned
Gladly sharing a name with Dexter Fowler!
by ShadowPenguin on Aug 27, 2009 5:32 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
The war against the wave
…can be fought conventionally, but that could take years and cost millions of lives.
No, we need to refuse to participate, and raise our children to know better.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
by RdRnnr on Aug 27, 2009 8:44 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I sometimes do the anti-wave
by standing until the wave comes by and then blatantly sitting down.
Although some might argue that’s as bad as the wave itself.
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by Andrew Martin on Aug 28, 2009 8:31 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like your ideas and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
I think I’ll do this from now on, whenever some idiot from the Rockpile gets one started.
Gladly sharing a name with Dexter Fowler!
by ShadowPenguin on Aug 28, 2009 10:31 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
The wave's alright if we're leading by more than 6 runs.
But otherwise it is lethal.
I went to the game last year when Cook could’ve got his 17th win, and the wave started, and he gave up a double so he got pulled. We lost 5-3.
BEAT LA! BEAT LA!
(Thanks to Denver Nuggets fans)
by prettyinpurple on Aug 28, 2009 2:45 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is there any details
about what the umpire said to Yorvit? I heard that he insulted him and he was having to be restrained. Then I hear that it had to do with Spilly’s getting high fived before he touched the plate after the homer. Then I hear that it was Tulo getting into it with the ump.
So what actually happened? They don’t show the Rockies games here so I didn’t get to see any of this, but I’m reading about 3 different stories on 3 or 4 different sites.
"Why don't you put that in a memo and entitle it 'Shit I Already Know'!" - Sarge from Red vs. Blue
I can't brain today, I have the dumb.
9 "Phinsider Feud" Points
by Chupathingy on Aug 25, 2009 2:07 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
we're getting the same two reports here
earlier today I read about the Yorvit thing and just now I read Tracy Ringolsby’s (sp?) column about the high-five incident.
I have not seen any specific reports on what was actually said to Yorvit, if that happened.
Aku, Soku, Zan
by haj_saitou on Aug 25, 2009 2:10 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
From what I heard
Again, this is all hearsay, but this is what allegedly happened.
1) The 2nd base umpire Miller, supposedly was upset with Yorvit for his body language following ball/strike calls from Campos. Might have been some sort of yelling match, but I didn’t see anything myself.
2) Tulo ran over and high fived Spilly along the 3rd base line, which could have been ruled interference, which would’ve sent Spilly back to third. But since the winning run was Eaton, who had already crossed the plate, there was no reason to enforce the rule. Therefore, they just warned Tulo about the rule.
Gladly sharing a name with Dexter Fowler!
by ShadowPenguin on Aug 25, 2009 2:17 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
When did the Miller/Yorvit inslut supposedly happen?
Post game? During the celebration? Or earlier in the game? Because Yorvit wasn’t on base in the 14th.
And I assume that it was Miller the umpire. There was a reference over at MCC that it was Miller the gas can pitcher rather than Miller the umpire who said something to Yorvit. I can’t really understand why either would do it at that point, but if it’s the umpire I’m sure MLB will be looking at the situation.
by Junction Rox on Aug 25, 2009 2:24 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, the Rockies celebration carried over near where the umpires were trying to leave
So it’s possible some things were said when they were in the area. Again, I haven’t seen the replay of Yorvit, so I can’t say for sure.
Gladly sharing a name with Dexter Fowler!
by ShadowPenguin on Aug 25, 2009 2:28 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ok, thanks for the info guys.
Like I said, we don’t get any Rockies games here unless they are playing the Cardinals or the Cubs, or if they are in the playoffs. So I have to rely on this place and Gameday to see whats going on in the Rox games.
"Why don't you put that in a memo and entitle it 'Shit I Already Know'!" - Sarge from Red vs. Blue
I can't brain today, I have the dumb.
9 "Phinsider Feud" Points
by Chupathingy on Aug 25, 2009 2:46 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn’t MLB in charge of the humidor in Denver?
vr, Xei
by Xeifrank on Aug 25, 2009 2:26 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
technically,
but it’s not like they hire the person who operates it or have total oversight. To accuse the Rockies of cheating with it is kind of dubious, though. Here are three of the biggest reasons, but not the only ones:
1. Lack of motive:
The Rockies already have the biggest home field advantage in the majors even without shenanigans and it’s not even close to the next best team. This advantage isn’t fair, but neither is the money advantage that some big market teams have and it’s perfectly legal by MLB rules.
2. Lack of opportunity
Because of the humidor, the baseballs at Coors Field are under more scrutiny than those at any other stadium. The same sort of ball switching that people suspect goes on in Denver could happen much easier anywhere else in Major League Baseball without anyone being the wiser. How hard would it be for any team to switch juiced baseballs to the umpire? Instead we get what amounts to an argument out of ignorance: The Rockies can’t prove that you’re not cheating, therefore they are cheating. You can’t prove your not a communist, therefore you are one.
3. No evidence outside some pretty flimsy and circumstantial cherry picked statistics and player anecdotes.
In order to orchestrate this, it would require a conspiracy including low level field staffers who don’t get paid or appreciated enough, and certainly one of them would be eager for the fifteen minutes of fame dropping the bombshell of the Rockies cheating ways would bring. Rockies ownership isn’t well loved in Denver, and there are many who would love to drag the Monforts through the mud with something like this. Why hasn’t anybody come forward? Accusing the Rockies of gamesmanship is one thing, implying that they’re cheating borders on libel/slander without much more than what we’ve seen so far when it comes to evidence.
by Rox Girl on Aug 25, 2009 3:12 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
How do
the Rockies have “the biggest home field advantage in the majors”?
"In the future, I want to be a fossil. Or, at least have my feces be fossilized"
-Pygalgia
by DbacksSkins on Aug 26, 2009 6:39 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
We're acclimated to the climate and altitude
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by Andrew Martin on Aug 26, 2009 10:36 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know the theory, but is there any proof?
I mean…. take a Rockies team and another team with very similar OPS+ and ERA+ and then compare their home records, or something like that?
"In the future, I want to be a fossil. Or, at least have my feces be fossilized"
-Pygalgia
by DbacksSkins on Aug 27, 2009 12:09 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's an athletics-wide thing
it’s not meant so much to be a “lol humidor” thing, but just that this altitude does negatively affect visiting players.
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by Andrew Martin on Aug 27, 2009 9:00 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL HUMIDOR
"In the future, I want to be a fossil. Or, at least have my feces be fossilized"
-Pygalgia
by DbacksSkins on Sep 1, 2009 4:31 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yo Giants...
The following did not contribute to your losses this past weekend:
1. Stadium Radar Guns
2. Purple dancing Dino’s behind home plate
3. Humidors
The following DID contribute:
1. Timely errors
2. Managerial Game Mismanagement
3. Complete lack of bench depth
by GreeleyRoxFan on Aug 25, 2009 4:26 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Pfft, you're such a homer
;-P
Gladly sharing a name with Dexter Fowler!
by ShadowPenguin on Aug 25, 2009 4:41 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Radar "doctoring" happens all over the place.
The only time it matters is when you have a conceited pitcher (apparently like Lincecum) that cares about it and lets it get to his head rather than focusing on the results he’s getting on the field (no hitter through 5.1 innings).
The direct humidor correlation is complete crap. The home plate umpire does not change the balls he has in his little satchel between innings. Thus, how could the Rockies ensure they would be the beneficiaries of the “juiced” balls. Particularly since an inning can consist of 3-10 pitches (with one ball) and 50 pitches (with dozens of balls). Complete crap.
by blooming rock on Aug 25, 2009 4:58 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
This may be a silly question
but how do they explain that the Rockies are 8 games better than the Giants on the road, while the Giants actually have a better home record than the Rockies?
Is there some secret second team plane containing Dinger, rigged radar guns and humidor altered baseballs that follows the Rockies around the country, taking these nefarious schemes on the road??
Or maybe we should be suspecting that the Giants are actually the ones altering the home park to their advantage. We’ll have to keep our eyes open this weekend…
by Junction Rox on Aug 25, 2009 5:59 PM MDT reply actions 2 recs
There you go...
project much, Giants?
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
by RdRnnr on Aug 25, 2009 10:58 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is the best counterargument yet
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Aug 26, 2009 8:35 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I lived in San Fran...
And moved there with no axe to grind about their teams or their fans.
And, as my experiences with that fanbase enfolded, um, wow. The ‘Niners never just lost a game by not playing as well as their opponent (and this is when they were good) they were victimized by cheating and bad calls, bad weather (believe it!) and nearly anything else. The Giants were just the targets of some sort of Dodger-centric MLB conspiracy. Or, the fans would put their faith in one guy who’d just not up to the job (say, Pedro Feliz) and then crucify him. So yeah, now Dinger, lying radar guns, and the humidor cost them their rightful playoff birth and here come the tears, I hope Jeff Cirillo doesn’t show up! A’s fans, however, are pretty great.
Keep in mind, San Francisco is a marvelous city and the people (I’d bet even the ones over at McCovey Chronicles) are very nice but as sports fans, they lend their counterparts in Boston an air of class.
by Since1993 on Aug 26, 2009 12:16 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Giants fans=Cubs fans
The oxen are slow, but the earth is patient.
by rockieprogress on Aug 26, 2009 12:29 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
As a giants fan...
Those all seem like bogus theories. Suck it up and face the facts media, the Giants lost because they were outcoached and outplayed by a better team.
1) The radar gun readings may/may not be true, but it doesn’t matter. I’m pretty sure AT&T does it too. Lincecum clearly didn’t have his best stuff and struggled with command, but I’m pretty sure he wasn’t in 88-90 range, especially since that’s where Zito was. I’m not sure about Jimenez hitting 99, but he does have one of the liveliest fastballs in the league.
2) I’m pretty sure Dave Fleming didn’t have any intent at calling the Rockies “cheaters” by his comments. Despite the fact that the Giants announcers seem pretty clueless to the team’s flaws, they don’t normally do that kind of thing.
3) The humidor conspiracy theory is kinda far-fetch’d.
The SF Sports base has always had loud dumb people before, but please don’t assume all of us are like that. Really.
P.S. Get Dinger out from behind the plate. As a fan, it’s really annoying to see him every pitch.
All right kids, now anytime Lincecum strikes out the side, go remind your mother who he is again.
by perfectstrat on Aug 26, 2009 12:46 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
The Dinger thing is the only one that seems unfair
In cricket, there is a sight screen (basically a large, movable white wall) on the boundary behind the bowler, so that the batsman will always be able to see both the bowler and the bowled ball. Any distractions, or a background that camouflages the ball, could be very dangerous.
While the same isn’t as much the case for the pitcher, it’s clearly bad sportsmanship to try and put him off, and if the presence of Dinger were even partly responsible for the pitcher being smacked by a line drive then that would be completely unacceptable. So I’m with the Giants fans on this one.
by biondino on Aug 26, 2009 5:04 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Am I the only one who read "Dinger" in a French accent?
“Dahn-jay”
by biondino on Aug 26, 2009 5:04 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
my vote is for "yes"
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by Andrew Martin on Aug 26, 2009 7:11 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Probably, but I'm going to pronounce his name that way from now on.
Dahn-jay it is.
by Rox Girl on Aug 26, 2009 8:57 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Clearly the batter's eye is the appropriate comparison
The sight screen opposite the bowler in cricket is used for advertising. The biggest benefit is that there’s at least 200ft from the bowler to the crowd.
Also, Dinger shouldn’t be allowed to do that shit. A fan would be chucked out for doing it so the same should be true for mascots.
by KindredSprites on Aug 26, 2009 8:13 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not true
I think it was a Yankees/Jays game where a bunch of guys came down all dressed like umps and mimicked everything the umps were doing, and acted all distracting.
These are professionals. If they’re more focused on Dinger than their catcher’s target, they probably shouldn’t be pitching.
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by Andrew Martin on Aug 26, 2009 10:37 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about at basketball games where the fans wave all those towels
behind the basket on free throws. Or Steelers fans with terrible towels in the end zone on field goals. Those fans aren’t thrown out for doing that. It’s part of the game. Not saying the sports can be compared, but the athletes can.
They are professionals. They are paid to focus on the game. They make their living that way. If a person dressed up in a silly dinosaur outfit can get into their head by wiggling around a little bit, they probably don’t deserve to be in the majors. Besides, Dinger only does it for a few seconds while the pitcher is getting set. He ducks down once the pitcher starts his motion.
Gladly sharing a name with Dexter Fowler!
by ShadowPenguin on Aug 27, 2009 5:36 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree...
There is alot of activity in that area all during the game…waiters, ushers , even one lady that sits on the front row during most games waves a white towel almost constantly. I would think that it must not be as distracting as it seems.
by butterfly on Aug 28, 2009 8:22 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
The lady with the cotton candy..
and lengths of licorice rope is very distracting. Hmm cotton candy!
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by Charlie77 on Aug 28, 2009 11:00 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
About the radar gun controversy
CBS sports
Rumors persist that the Coors Field pranksters messed with the radar-gun readings on the scoreboard during Sunday’s Lincecum/Jimenez battle. This might explain why Jimenez was consistently clocked at 106 MPH, while Lincecum didn’t hit 65 all afternoon. Shame on them for messing with that most fragile of entities, the ballplayer’s psyche.
http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/story/12111833
The oxen are slow, but the earth is patient.
by rockieprogress on Aug 26, 2009 9:38 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Mocking stupidity is always a good response.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
by RdRnnr on Aug 26, 2009 10:17 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Apparently...
…the Rockies weren’t up to said tomfoolery during the first 32 games of the season.
Or last year.
Or the first 140 games of 2007.
Or at any other time in the humidor era.
They just mess with it some of the time.
by DomCasual on Aug 26, 2009 11:27 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Hey,
everything has a beginning.
"In the future, I want to be a fossil. Or, at least have my feces be fossilized"
-Pygalgia
by DbacksSkins on Aug 26, 2009 6:39 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
shaddup
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by Andrew Martin on Aug 26, 2009 10:37 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

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