Fanpost per bloggers request
by PinchHitLancePainter on Sep 15, 2009 2:02 PM MDT
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I posted this to last night's recap and with some recommendations I place it in a FP for general consumption.
They need to be more agreessive at the plate.
how many first pitch FBs down the middle taken for strike one to be followed by secondary pitches chased. Last week I went to the game with an advance scout of an NL playoff team and old friend from my playing days. He was working on the playoff dossiere.
Some notes from him after several beers and reliving the glory of places like Pompano Beach and Tulsa:
- The book on the Rockies is to get the first pitch over and then they will chase anything close thereafter.
-The majority of the Rockies hitters have been pounded into patience and taking pitches but this strategy is errant on the road away from Coors. Notice the volume of off speed seen tonite. Offspeeds at sea level they break more pronounced especially on the West Coast in the heavy air. Rockies are very vulnerable to off speed after extended homestands, especially in the first two-three games of a series.
-Pitchers will use this tendacy to slow down the offense attack. The only solution is to start expecting and connecting with 1st pitch FBs down the middle.
-Several noted chasers were identified:
Hawpe, Barmes, Stewart, Gonzalez, Ianneta, Fowler, Atkins. Hawpe he was extremely disappointed in. He thought Hawpe had figured it out this year and has now subsequently forgotten the things that worked for him. A interesting tidbit was that he felt Hawpe should hit 3rd behind the runners and get more FBs. He felt Helton could hit anywhere.
-They also mentioned that Smith should be thrown offspeed at all costs as he may be one of the best FB hitters in the game right now. No book on Helton as his zone is keen and he will not chase. GIambi was also given high praise for his approach at the plate and his ability to mesh in a new role. Yorvit should be fed all breaking stuff and is an excellent mistake FB hitter especially up above the hands.
-Another observation of note. He felt the Rocks did Fowler a disservice by bypassing AAA and felt he should have played there all year until August. Reason, not physically strong enough yet.
-The team is very bizarre in that it slumps and explodes together.
-Finally, another interesting observation that RoxGirl will love. Atkins has played the last two years completely out of shape and has cost himself millions in the process. Apparently word in MLB circles is he is lazy beyond reason. Word is his agent is putting him on a strict diet and regiment with a personal trainer after this season which could lure someone to take a flier.
Eat. Drink. Be Merry. But the above FanPost does not necessarily reflect the attitudes, opinions, or views of Purple Row's staff (unless, of course, it's written by the staff [and even then, it still might not]).
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Good idea, putting it here
More people will see it.
Leave Dexter alone! You're lucky he even performs for you!
Thanks for putting it up here
This is great stuff that we can all now “read and learn”.
As a spectator, it is not superstition to believe that your behavior influences the outcome of the game… it is narcissism
They need to be more agressive at the plate
That is exactly what Tracy said when he first took over. What happened?
The" butterfly effect ", which theorizes that a change in something seemingly innocuous, such as a flap of a butterfly's wings, may have unexpected larger consequences in the future, such as . . .winning the World Series.
Atkins
‘’which could lure someone to take a flier.’’
I gather you mean as a free agent? The Rockies wouldn’t consider tendering him a contract would they?
by Hizilla on Sep 16, 2009 9:02 PM MDT via mobile reply actions
doubtful
He’s still arbitration eligible, so it could end up being very expensive. We’ll probably non-tender him, as he’ll garner starter money.
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by Andrew Martin on Sep 17, 2009 6:53 AM MDT up reply actions
He seems the most likely non-tender...
It will be interesting to see what happens in the off-season with Clint Barmes and Yorvit Torrealba as well. Those two players the Rockies are more likely to want to keep, but their money situations (Torrealba’s an FA, Barmes in his last arbitration year) and projected roles with the team might make for some added drama. I guess you could put Jason Marquis, Rafael Betancourt and Huston Street in that boat of players that the Rockies will want to retain but will have to make difficult decisions or too expensive contract offers in order to do so. I’ve been focusing on 2009 so much that I haven’t really thought about 2010, but there will be some considerable roster shaking in the winter.
Raffy is my biggest question mark
Barmes will still be relatively cheap, as he sucks at the plate (you know what I mean).
Street is worth what we pay for him.
I’m in the extreme boat of offering Marquis arbitration, get the 2nd rounder and sandwich, and trying to get Javier Vazquez on board. I just don’t see Marquis as being somebody who can repeat this. I’ll get more into why when the offseason strikes, we’re still going and still need Marquis to be awesome.
Torrealba…ehhhhhhhhh it’s such a tough call. My concern with Torrealba is that with him around, Iannetta will never get the shot to really reclaim his starting shot. Even then, that’s kind of faulty thinking, because before August, who would have ever thought this? Torrealba is more than likely to return to being terrible
But Betancourt…if we can retain him somehow for less than his option, I think we should keep him. I feel as if the only real option with Betancourt is to decline his option and offer him arbitration. Reason being, if he accepts, we get a discount. If he declines, type A draft picks.
Reason for letting him leave is that we have a bunch of arms returning to/joining our bullpen in 2010: Buchholz, Corpas, potentially Weathers, and then whoever looks to make an impact that we’re not expecting from the minors.
However, reason for NOT letting him leave is that Betancourt-to-Street is a solid closing staff. Is Corpas ready to re-take this kind of responsibility? Will Buchholz be? I strongly doubt that Weathers will be. We’re banking on a guy returning from injury to assume a relatively big role in the bullpen. Fact of the matter is that Betancourt is an 8th inning guy, and he’s a good 8th inning guy. I hate to cite Veteran Presence but it’s kind of that situation.
Having a bullpen containing all of those parts is gonna be a good thing. A lot of weapons for Tracy to work with. Of course, he’s just gonna have everybody pitch into the 8th every night anyhow, so this is moot, we might as well just keep like Street, Buchholz, and Weathers and trade everyone else.
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by Andrew Martin on Sep 17, 2009 3:22 PM MDT up reply actions
I’m with you on all of this basically, and the first i’ve heard anyone suggest trying to get Vazquez. What would you propose to get him? The Braves are kind of in win now mode next year and need a big bat – i’m not sure prospects would do the job to get him, although I like the thought of him pitching for the Rockies. I think he’s been a really underrated guy the last few years, maybe all of Ozzie’s comments have made people overlook him.
With Torrealba, I wonder if he keeps it up this fall what he’ll get offered elsewhere – seems like there are too many catching prospects coming up right now to spend much money on him.
RMN has been driving the GET VAZQUEZ wagon all season :)
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Sep 17, 2009 9:01 PM MDT up reply actions
Consider me on that bandwagon. I guess missing that is what I get for being away from the interwebz all summer. Did you finally move down to Denver?
by Hizilla on Sep 17, 2009 11:37 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
I actually landed a job based in Fort Collins
so I wasn’t forced/able to move to the big city. At least not yet
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Sep 18, 2009 2:00 AM MDT up reply actions
I believe
he’s said that he’s on the road in Wyoming a lot but not that he moved there.
"If we never try, we shall never succeed." - Abraham Lincoln
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
I live in Windsor
Office in Fort Collins, but I’m usually on the road for 3-4 days mid-week in Wyoming. Next week: Wheatland, Fort Laramie and Cheyenne
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Sep 20, 2009 1:46 PM MDT up reply actions
thing with the Braves
is that they may be in win now, but they also can’t afford Vazquez. He’d be a one-year rental, so I truly can’t picture the cost being too high.
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Chris Iannetta Status: OH MY GOD GET SOME HITS YOU'RE MAKING ME LOOK LIKE AN ASS
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by Andrew Martin on Sep 17, 2009 9:42 PM MDT up reply actions
Their payroll situation is pretty complicated. Does Chipper retire? I think no. Do they pick up the option on Huddy? I think yes. Do they resign Laroche? Who knows. I suppose the Rockies situation is just as complicated. Javy would be pretty sweet slotted into that number two slot. Although, I vaguely remember him having the right to veto a trade to the NL West, could be a figment of my imagination.
by Hizilla on Sep 17, 2009 11:42 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
Not a figment,
He’s definitely a player that wants to stay toward the East to be closer to his family. The Rockies aren’t going to be signing him.
oh I know
but I’m shooting high. He’s a pipe dream. (also we’d be trading for him, as a 1-year rental, rather than signing him out of FA.)
I think the idea of getting a rental isn’t a bad idea, because I have very little faith in Chacin and Rogers and whoever else might be coming up the pipe at this point. I don’t mean long-run, I just mean 2010, or out of spring training 2010 anyhow.
But that depends on how we view our staff next season, without Marquis.
1. Ubaldo Jimenez
2. Aaron Cook
3. Jorge De La Rosa
4. Jason Hammel
5. Jeff Francis/Franklin Morales
Otherwise it’s pretty much the same staff as this year. The big question will be what we do with Franklin Morales and/or Francis if he’s back and healthy and capable of giving us 170+ IP of league-average ball.
Mike McCoy Status: FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
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by Andrew Martin on Sep 18, 2009 9:14 AM MDT up reply actions
I'm fine with what we have for the rotation...
I’m not going to complain if a good deal for another starter falls into our lap (it’s not going to be Vazquez) but I don’t think it’s a pressing issue to go out and give up young talent for a rental. Those top four should be alright and the Rockies have so many options for #5 that I don’t see this being a big deal until one of those top four pitchers starts complaining about shoulder tightness.
Pitching in the MLB sometimes seems to be a maturing process, like waiting for a wine or cheese to come of age. The Rockies seem to do a better job than other teams of recognizing this and picking up guys like JDLR or Hammel right when they are about to turn the corner. If it comes to it, I think O’Dowd will look to go that route again rather than going for a guy who’s already producing at an elite level, and therefore expensive, like Vazquez.
Between Francis/Morales/Chacin/Friedrich/Rogers/Deduno/Smith and yeah, even Reynolds, the Rockies shouldn’t have to go out of house next season though. That’s a boatload of guys at the AA level or higher who could be ready to be positive MLB contributors in 2010.
could be ready, sure
I know you don’t have a crystal ball, but do you really think that any of them are actually ready to be positive contributors?
The thing is, if we’re comfortable with saying that DLR and Hammel are good enough to rationalize calling them a #3 and #4 rather than #4 and #5, then sure, we can toss somebody into the #5 and not have high expectations.
My issue is that I don’t have to have a revolving door #5 slot. (If injuries happen and we have to be constantly juggling, then so be it.) If somebody steps up, takes the role, and keeps running, then great. But I feel more likely that Chacin will win the spot, pitch a couple good games, mostly bad games, get demoted, Rogers will get a look, get lit up, get demoted, Deduno, demoted, Smith, breaks, ad infinitum. I know we could do worse in the 5 hole, but considering how great it’s been to know that we have a legit chance to win with Hammel in the 5 has probably been a huge confidence boost to a team as a whole, not to mention the fact that we’ve won more games with him there than a toss-in player.
Reason, overall that I suggest this, is that I feel our rotation would take a step back if we threw prospect-mc-not-ready into the 5 hole. If pre-season, Aaron Cook was an 8, Ubaldo was a 7, DLR a 5, Hammel a 3, and Marquis a 6, that’d mean our rotation was good for 29/50, pre season. (These are all relatively arbitrary, and relative to our team, of course.)
After this season, I put Ubaldo as a 9, Cook as a 7, DLR a 7, and Hammel a 5. That right there is worth 28/50, so conceivably, a throw-in guy wouldn’t be any worse than 2, so I guess we’d be ahead to start 2010 compared to where we thought we’d be starting 2009. I can’t see Marquis as better than a 6, more realistically a 5 once a few numbers regress, and we’d be paying him a decent chunk of change. This is my reason for going out-of-house, if we’re going to pay Marquis a decent chunk of money to regress and eventually block Rogers/Chacin/Friedrich/Deduno/Reynolds/Alan Johnson (:V) then we might as well use the money for a 1-year rental stud’s salary (cough Halladay cough) and have ourselves a rotation worth 38/50, according to my arbitrary rotation rating scale.
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by Andrew Martin on Sep 18, 2009 11:14 AM MDT up reply actions
When are prospects ever ready in your scenario?
If you never trust them they never get a chance to prove they can be trusted. At some point Ubaldo Jimenez went from being erratic young arm with promise to top of the rotation pitcher.JDLR went from journeyman to our de facto #2, Hammel from a bust as a prospect in Tampa to a solid mid-rotation guy. For all three of these pitchers that transformation happened in the last 15 months. I think Morales is on the cusp of this kind of transformation and if we put him back in the rotation in 2010, I think we’d see tremendous results. I think Chacin is really close, I definitely don’t see mostly bad starts from him in 2010, I see it weighted to the positive side even though there will be rough patches. I think other prospects like Rogers, Deduno and Friedrich may be as erratic as you imply but who knows, they’ve all got the stuff to suggest otherwise if they learn how to use it. Obviously Francis has already been there.
The cost of getting a Halladay or Vazquez type, a legit, proven top of the rotation starter, even as a one year rental I imagine will be either CarGo or Fowler or Friedrich plus another prospect. I’m not sure who else would entice them, maybe Seth Smith or Ian Stewart if we’re really lucky, but there will likely be a substantial 2010 price from another part of the team to pay for your rotation upgrade. At that point I wouldn’t know if it was worth it considering these near ready parts we already have on hand to fill the slot.
I see those as different scenarios
Ubaldo in 2007 was out of necessity, we didn’t HAVE anyone legitimate to make the start, so at that point, what did we have to lose? Our pitching rotation was Jeff Francis, Aaron Cook…uh…
I see this as the difference between a team that’s allllmost there and a team that is right in the thick of it.
Throwing Ubaldo in the rotation in 2007 (and Morales for that matter) was a “eh, what could it hurt?” kind of scenario.
However, being the “arrived” team we are right now, and not just a magic trick in September, I feel as if we have more at stake here. We have to posture ourselves carefully, so we remain a Winning Team™. Halladay was a tongue-in-cheek suggestion, I’ll admit, but I feel like we can’t risk a starting spot for somebody who isn’t really major-league ready.
This is why I’m looking for a 1-year rental: It’ll give Chacin, Rogers, Deduno, Friedrich, etc, time to face some stiffer competition in AAA, adjust to altitude (like conditioning, not humidor-esque), not rush them, and not turn them all into Morales or Reynolds and inadvertently stunt them.
This whole conversation would be moot had I taken the 30 seconds to ask Marc Gustafson what their plan for Franklin Morales was.
Out of everybody in-house, Morales is the best option. Should the organization decide to try him out in the rotation – and he proves he’s ready – I have no qualms with a Ubaldo-Cook-DLR-Hammel-Morales rotation. Or Francis instead of Morales, again, assuming he wins back a rotation spot.
My concern is more or less panicky. I don’t want to lose this edge we have. I want to keep our developmental model while building towards being better than the Dodgers. It’s very much a having cake/eating said cake type of situation, I won’t lie. Vazquez/Halladay/Lee/2nd coming of Ferguson Jenkins would give us a further edge, give us the head above the Dodgers’ shoulders.
(As a side-note, I looked into players who are FAs after 2010 or have an option on 2010 or whatever, and nobody available not named Halladay or Lee or Vazquez, and with the guys available, we might as well just let our own staff take the reins.)
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by Andrew Martin on Sep 18, 2009 2:35 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
These two need to get a room
don’t you think?
by PinchHitLancePainter on Sep 21, 2009 3:35 PM MDT up reply actions
oh we've finished
straightened the sheets, etc.
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Seth Smith Status: Bludgeoning Baseballs
Chris Iannetta Status: OH MY GOD GET SOME HITS YOU'RE MAKING ME LOOK LIKE AN ASS
Check out the most recent MLB Transactions on MLB Daily Dish
by Andrew Martin on Sep 21, 2009 4:05 PM MDT up reply actions
not my department
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by Andrew Martin on Sep 21, 2009 5:46 PM MDT up reply actions
WolfMarauder is the film student
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Sep 22, 2009 9:12 AM MDT up reply actions
If we can't get Javier Vazquez
how about Rich Harden?
If we let Marquis and Betancourt go, the compensation picks we get with them can help offset the loss of the picks incurred by signing Harden.
Or am I still the only one on this blog who thinks signing Rich Harden is a good idea…
The Rockies need some oldschool purple/white striped high socks. The team’s problem is it’s lack of swagger. I feel strongly that these socks will provide the swagger necessary to tap the potential that are the Rockies.
there's a huge difference
Vazquez is only signed through next year, ergo, he’d be a rental and then POOF gone
Harden would require a multiple year contract.
Mike McCoy Status: FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Seth Smith Status: Bludgeoning Baseballs
Chris Iannetta Status: OH MY GOD GET SOME HITS YOU'RE MAKING ME LOOK LIKE AN ASS
Check out the most recent MLB Transactions on MLB Daily Dish
by Andrew Martin on Sep 20, 2009 1:42 PM MDT up reply actions
I think we'd have to give up a good amount
to get Vazquez.
I think due to his injury history and atypical season in ‘09, Harden won’t be offered many long contracts. Maybe we can get him on a 2 year deal with an option for a third or maybe no compensation picks at the end or something.
The Rockies need some oldschool purple/white striped high socks. The team’s problem is it’s lack of swagger. I feel strongly that these socks will provide the swagger necessary to tap the potential that are the Rockies.
If we can get him something of that nature, I'd be down with Harden
but some team will be dumb enough to offer him 5 years or something like that.
Mike McCoy Status: FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Seth Smith Status: How do you like me now?!
Chris Iannetta Status: Yeah...see you in the Spring, big guy...
by Andrew Martin on Sep 22, 2009 2:00 PM MDT up reply actions
*coughMetropolitanscough*
The Rockies need some oldschool purple/white striped high socks. The team’s problem is it’s lack of swagger. I feel strongly that these socks will provide the swagger necessary to tap the potential that are the Rockies.
We are never ever
going to get a “bargain” on FA pitchers that some other team wants. Just not going to happen.
Why
do you think you’d get comp picks for Marquis? Is he a Type B?
Posting 65 comments/day since June '07.
He's type B
Mike McCoy Status: FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Seth Smith Status: Bludgeoning Baseballs
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Check out the most recent MLB Transactions on MLB Daily Dish
by Andrew Martin on Sep 21, 2009 7:16 AM MDT up reply actions
Really?
Hmmmm…. now I’m somewhat impressed. Good luck with that.
Posting 65 comments/day since June '07.
For your reference
you can find the latest projected rankings here. I imagine that there will be a new projection out in sometime this week or next.
my friends and i have noticed atkins being out of shape
he always seems to be breathing super hard after running the bases. we having been calling him fatkins all season because of it. so hearing that scout say that was not surprising.
but yeah i can see the headline now…Garrett goes on the Atkins diet
Heck, his .BA has been on a diet all year
Watching the purple row from high atop the big brown monolith on California Ave
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