Wednesday Rockpile: Miguel Olivo Deadline Looms For Colorado Rockies
by Russ Oates on Nov 3, 2010 9:01 AM MDT
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PrintRuss's Note: The user interface and Jeff got into a battle, which has yet to turn into Jeff's favor. Below is his Rockpile.
Now that the pesky postseason is done, we can finally shift our focus to the offseason. We'll have plenty of offseason content for you (at least I know that I do), so don't go anywhere. WolfMarauder gave a nice timeline of this year's MLB offseason recently -- and we're almost at the very first event, the declaration of free agency, which occurs 1-5 days after the World Series ends. WM also gave a list of the Rockies who are able to declare free agency without restriction:
- LHP Joe Beimel
- LHP Jorge De La Rosa (Type A)
- IF Jason Giambi
- IF Melvin Mora
- OF Jay Payton
Of those players, De La Rosa is the only player who the Rockies will receive a compensation pick for if they offer him arbitration, he declines, and he signs with another team. I wrote about how free agency compensation works last year. Per WM's article, Colorado must decide whether or not to offer arbitration by the 23rd, with the player needing to decide if they accept by the 30th.
In addition to those five players listed above, the Rockies will have to make other important roster decisions, most notably whether to pick up the options they hold on three players:
- RHP Octavio Dotel ($4.5 million w/ $250 thousand buyout, Club) (Type B)
- LHP Jeff Francis ($7 million, Club)
- C Miguel Olivo ($2.5 million w/ $500 thousand buyout, Club) (Type B)
Dotel is as good as gone and Francis' option will probably be declined but Colorado could bring him back for less money (though they aren't offering much guaranteed money so if he receives a good offer from another team he's gone too). Olivo is the interesting case here. Coming into the offseason, I thought there was no way that the Rockies would decline this option, as Olivo had just spent the year as the starter and had been above league average while the option was cheap. I also thought that the option was mutual (meaning that the Rockies would need Olivo's consent to bring him back) but Troy Renck indicates that Olivo's option is in fact a club option. The deadline for a decision on this option is tomorrow, so we'll know pretty soon if Olivo will be back with the club or not.
As Renck states, there are three real possibilities for the Rockies with Olivo: exercise the option and keep him, decline the option and pay him $500k, or exercise the option and trade him. Declining the option or trading Olivo shows that the team has confidence in Chris Iannetta (even if Tracy doesn't) while keeping Olivo means that Colorado isn't sold on its catching (including Mike McKenry). There's always a team looking for a catcher so I think that despite Olivo's awful second half there would be takers on the trade option (but there's definitely a possibility that O'Dowd wouldn't get the right trade package for him). Personally, I'm pretty pessimistic about Olivo going forward (see my 2010 catcher audit) so I'd lean toward the sign and trade option.
More news after the jump
Rockies News
Thomas Harding writes that the Rockies aren't going to make a big splash in free agency, with their biggest potential move likely being the re-signing of De La Rosa and signing/trading for a right-handed bat. As Harding writes, the payroll and team construction will likely be similar in 2011 to 2010, though with the flexibility the Rockies gained through Todd Helton deferring money they will have $15 or so million to spend just to get to last year's payroll amount. I'll have more details on that situation tomorrow when I reveal my preliminary payroll predictions.
Speaking of roster flexibility, the Rockies gained some when they were granted a fourth option year on 2006 first round pick Greg Reynolds since he was injured so much in 2009 and didn't get 60 days of active service. Reynolds had looked pretty good as 2010 wound down, so it's good that the Rockies get another year to see if he can develop into a decent rotation candidate.
Continuing with the 40 man roster, OF Cole Garner was placed on the 40 man roster to stop him from leaving for minor league free agency. This move temporarily fills up the 40 man roster (until players declare free agency they take up spots on the roster). Project LIBRA has more on the 40 man roster if you are interested.
Staying in the minor leagues, ITR has an AFL update -- relief prospects Bruce Billings and Rex Brothers were chosen to pitch in the AFL Rising Stars game.
Finally, the Pittsburgh Pirates plan to speak with former Rockies manager Clint Hurdle about their open job. The rebuilding situation the Pirates face is not an unfamiliar one for Hurdle.
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Dotel's option was turned down, and also filed for free agency along with the other five.
He is a Type B.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
Not as of yet.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 9:46 AM MDT up reply actions
we get a draft pick for someone signing Dotel?
This is good news.
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~Art Hill
JFK
If we offer arbitration.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 9:46 AM MDT up reply actions
yeah well...
I did kind of jump the gun there a little bit. I don’t know if I want the Rockies to offer him arbitration because he might accept, although with his history as a closer/late innings reliever someone should want him so he might decline.
Why is baseball so confusing and difficult to predict? (of course this is what makes it great too)
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~Art Hill
JFK
I don't think the Rockies will bother with an arb offer for Dotel.
We already have an expensive (and full) bullpen, and an extra Round 2 pick isn’t really worth the $5+ million we’d lose from our offseason budget wiggle room on such a transaction.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 9:49 AM MDT up reply actions
Thanks again
I should not be here right now, especially since my mind is a bit tired from my 7:30am test this morning.
I agree that a the supplemental pick is not worth $3M as deacs states below. Arbitration is not necessary and I don’t think the Rockies will offer it (now that I’m thinking and seeing a little bit more of the larger picture).
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~Art Hill
JFK
He could make even more, I think.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 9:50 AM MDT up reply actions
He might not accept, but it's probably too much a possibility for the offer to be justified.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 9:50 AM MDT up reply actions
Dotel had a crappy season but he was recently a really good reliever!
And may well be one again. He would probably not be the disaster that people seem to instinctively imagine.
Probably not, but he's definitely not worth an arb offer
He doesn’t fit in our pen next season, and if he accepts arb, we’re stuck with him.
He might be good again, he might not, but the risk of his acceptance tying our hands isn’t worth the possibility he declines arb.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
He didn't really have a "crappy season" over the entirety
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 11:19 AM MDT up reply actions
Let him go
We haven’t seen enough of Dotel in a Rockies uniform for a realistic assessment. But it appears he is not worth the money he would get in arbitration. Turn him loose.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 12:04 PM MDT up reply actions
Again, sorry for the late Rockpile everyone. First I was unable to post anything and then my internet went down.
Very frustrating.
The writer formerly known as Jabberwocky
READ and LEARN about the business of baseball at Purple Row Academy
Eschew Obfuscation!
That's fine by me
I still had something to come back to after my test.
I like the sig: The writer formerly known as Jabberwocky
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~Art Hill
JFK
Problem with not keeping Olivo at this point...
Rockies are probably not going to sign VMart. If they don’t retain Olivo, what was the point of holding Iannetta back all year? The FA maret beyond Olivo is unlikely to yield a better catcher for the price.
As much as I wished Olivo had been strictly backup this year, the team has painted itself into a corner where they almost have to keep him. They treated their young guy like crap and don’t have any other able in-house options, so what’s the plan if Olivo doesn’t return?
I'm not sure I see what you are worried about here
if we let Olivo go, seems to me the plan would be the same as last year (and the year before, and the year before): Iannetta presumptive starter, someone else to back up. If DOD doesn’t think Iannetta can possibly be the starter, he should be the one to go.
I agree here.
But I do wonder if they want someone with more experience than McKenry around. I’m not sure they feel comfortable assuming that Iannetta will finally be what they want him to without some kind of fail safe.
I think Olivo was the fail-safe until Tracy thought differently.
I sort of wonder if Iannetta shouldn’t just be thrown to the wolves now, so to speak. Tell him, you’re it. Give him April and May to prove he can do the job. Maybe if there is no good fail-safe he’ll perform better?
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
But what if he doesn't?
We trade for a catcher, suffer through the whole season with subpar performance? That’s my question.
I dunno. It's a tough call.
I still think that he might be better off elsewhere but who do we get?
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
At some point Iannetta will have to step up or go
but it’s probably not this year. The concept of two decent starting-caliber catchers instead of one “starter” and one “backup” is pretty attractive. Your point on McKenry is spot-on. There’s a much bigger gap between Iannetta (or Olivo) and McKenry than there is between the presumptive regular and the player who would take over in the case of injury at every other position I can think of.
I don’t see how the team could afford to let Olivo go and not replace him through free agency, and given that it’s best just to pick up the option and keep him.
"The game of baseball is made up of many little things. If we do all the little things right, then we'll never have a big thing to worry about" -- Cal Ripken, Sr.
Yankee Haters Encouragement Group Member #3
Keep Olivo
Agree. CDI is tradeable. Olivo seems a lot more solid. Trying to get someone like him in free agancy is apt to be expensive. Hang on to Miguel first, then decide whether Iannetta is worth keeping.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 12:12 PM MDT up reply actions
I certainly agree
that someone other than McKenry should get the nod, and I’ll be surprised if that isn’t the case. I just don’t think we can/should expect to find some other starter out there. If we jettison Olivo, it HAS to be because DOD is giving CDI the early track on the job. If he loses it (again) to someone else, so it goes.
This is a tough call for DOD though, dealing with two talented, but seriously flawed guys. I have no idea what criteria he will use for the decision, and I won’t be surprised at all if he just brings them both back and throws it back at Tracy to figure out.
Well, that is kinda Tracy's job
DOD has done his…he’s provided Tracy talented catchers. Unless your name is Posey or Mauer or McCann, you’re not a talented catcher with no obvious flaws.
Not picking up Olivo’s option lets Tracy off the hook. DOD doesn’t need to take ownership of this situation. Both are on affordable deals, both have either significant strengths or have shown flashes of them.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
That is a fair way to look at it, I suppose
But at the end of the day, DOD is Tracy’s boss and if he doesn’t like how Tracy is doing something (or doesn’t want to give Tracy the chance to do something) it is incumbent on him to make the call, a la Sabean trading Molina.
My point is simlply that DOD needs to decide if HE thinks CDI is good enough to be the starter. If no, CDI should be moved while he has some seblance of value, and Olivo retained. If yes, explore other options for moving Olivo and if none are better, keep both. Of course, its entirely possible that DOD is happy with what Tracy did last year, and will let it play out similarly. In any case, DOD has to make the threshold decision.
It seems to me that DOD did think CDI was the option last season. Otherwise, he would not have
signed him to a 3 year, 8+M, deal. I’m not so sure that DOD and JM are as much on the same page as we would like to think. I voted to sign and trade MO, but I’m not sure I really think that is the best option.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I think they're on the same page in terms of wanting CDI to be the guy
but not comfortable on counting on that. And they have no reason to, IMO.
Maybe so.
But agree that he hasn’t given them total confidence.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Heh.
I don’t think he’d be ready yet, anyway.
But I really can’t wait for the Rosario era. (Hoping I’m not setting myself up for disappointment.)
Rosario sure looked good during the Futures game...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I haven't actually seen him play.
Just seen a couple short vids and read all the pebble reports, scouting reports, etc. But I sure am excited about him anyway.
That is true for last year
No doubt going into ST, the FO thought CDI was the man. But is it still true? I guess we’ll soon see.
Given
the general crapshoot of offensive catchers, plus some likely regression from Olivo, Iannetta probably isn’t that much worse if at all. I’m guessing the 2 mill it would cost to keep Olivo over McKenry is best spent elsewhere…
"These are thin mints. I put them in the freezer. My favorites. So good."
--Reds outfielder Adam Dunn, on the girl scout cookies he keeps in his locker
We should work up a trade
for Brandon Phillips…not that he’s available or anything…
"These are thin mints. I put them in the freezer. My favorites. So good."
--Reds outfielder Adam Dunn, on the girl scout cookies he keeps in his locker
And Renck is also on the catcher situation:
The Rockies are leaning toward Olivo not coming back, either through trade or declining option. But it remains fluid.
And if Olivo goes, it doesn’t mean Iannetta definitely starter. There are a lot of interesting options, like Napoli. Could they swing trade?
So what I am saying is the catcher’s situation will be evolving this winter.
I actually like the Napoli idea a lot
and personally, I don’t think I’d pick up Olivo’s option with the intention of trading him. Too much unknown. Just move on and figure out how to reallocate the money you’ve saved.
"These are thin mints. I put them in the freezer. My favorites. So good."
--Reds outfielder Adam Dunn, on the girl scout cookies he keeps in his locker
hopefully a deal on the low end
because the Angels, or at least Scioscia isn’t too high on him. He’s also going into his final year of arbitration (I think) and would make somewhere around 5 or 6 mill…
"These are thin mints. I put them in the freezer. My favorites. So good."
--Reds outfielder Adam Dunn, on the girl scout cookies he keeps in his locker
I'm pumped that the Rox are keeping Garner around.
Just an average guy with exceptional hair. Nothing more, nothing less.
Bear Naked - My thoughts on sports, music, and life.
by Bryan Kilpatrick on Nov 3, 2010 11:55 AM MDT reply actions
Garner?
Tell me more about Garner. Is he good enough to replace Dex?
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 12:14 PM MDT up reply actions
No, and his ceiling is not nearly as high
He was a high school teammate of Ian Stewart’s. I’m sure Bryan can go far deeper in terms of advanced saber numbers, but the impression I got is that he profiles as a 4th or 5th OFer. RH batter. Can possibly be an upgrade over Spilly in that role, perhaps. But I’ll leave that to those smarter than I, which is…..everyone else.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
Maybe a comparison to Jay Payton can be made?
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~Art Hill
JFK
Yes, but I think Payton probably had more power potential
But it’s a fair comparison. Garner can be a useful addition to a ballclub, and maybe, our ballclub. But it’s probably no better than 50/50 that he’s really ML full time starter potential.
Maybe Todd Hollandsworth would be an apt comparison, as well.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
There better be WS parade for the Rockies in Denver next November .
Anything less is unacceptable.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
as long
as it happens on a Saturday because then a lot of people don’t have to miss school and work and the traffic doesn’t get in the way of these important functions. I never understood events like this in the middle of the week anyway (kind of like Opening Day at 1:00pm on a Monday).
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~Art Hill
JFK
Parade?
I don’t think anyone is concerned about scheduling the parade yet. We just need to bring the WS trophy to Colorado.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 12:22 PM MDT up reply actions
My point was that the parade meant we won the WS.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I will say the Giants do have a pretty good parade going.
They are driving people around in classic old cars, like from the 40’s and 50’s…That’s pretty cool
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Keep Jorge and Melvin
Naturally we want to keep JDLR. Hopefully they have a plan for keeping MM as well. I do not know who all likes Payton, but he seems like an affordable bench player. I think the plan to retain Francis at a lower pay is a good one. Giambi seems to be in reasonably good shape still and has a decent attitude. Hopefully they can land him on the cheap.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 12:21 PM MDT reply actions
Giambi is the only player departing via FA that I am absolutely opposed to returning.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 3:10 PM MDT up reply actions
Agree.
Absolutely need someone who can play a little OF or catcher in addition to first in his place.
Yeah - he is not the answer
I agree that Giambi is not the answer to anything the Rox need to do this off season. But if he’s cheap, he is at least a reasonable bat off the bench. Would be much better to get a few stronger players. You’re right Giambi is not versatile enough to be of great value this late in his career. But I suspect DOD and Tracy are ordering up a lineup based on team priorities. They appear to have acted prudently in not offering arb to Dotel.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 5:37 PM MDT up reply actions
In addition to the lack of versatility, I'd rather have a right handed bat to spell Helton.
PROJECT LIBRA: Depth / Transactions
"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:39 PM MDT up reply actions
Sad story
Sparky Anderson’s in hospice care, suffering from end stage dementia.
For those who are younger and may not know, Sparky was not only one of the best managers of all time, but one of the more interesting and entertaining. Sad times.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
Wow...that is really really sad. I had no idea. I always liked Sparky.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Huh, Rob Schneider is part of the Comcast crew discussing the Giants
Dude knows his baseball and the Giants. He’s actually really very good.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I wouldn't say you "missed" much. I'm just surprised at how knowledgable and articulate
Schneider is regarding baseball.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
One little beef I have is all the thong talk. As though Huff started the Thong thing
I think he owes Jason Giambi something. But no thongs.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
D'backs not likely to re-sign Brandon Webb.........
Do the Rockies take a chance?
According to Magruder "the Diamondbacks have had no conversations with Webb about a new contract and they do not plan to initiate talks moving forward."
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/11/03/diamondbacks-likely-wont-try-to-re-sign-brandon-webb/
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Pass, he wasn't even hitting 84 on the gun, iirc
Too bad, he was a hell of a pitcher, but remember when we were talking about how shoulder injuries are far more unlikely to come back from than elbow injuries? And we got the relative good side of it with Francis? It seems clear Webb got the wrong side of it.
I think it’s very unlikely Webb is ever anything more than a barely-hanging-on journeyman ever again, and maybe not even that. Too bad, because he was a hell of a pitcher.
Maybe, just maybe, I offer him a non-guaranteed spring training invite at the ML minimum….and there’s also no chance he takes that.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
Brandon
See what he’s got, then decide. Everyone’s a bit different. Maybe he’s good enough to spell Hammel. And if he rehabilitates eventually he could be a real asset.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 1:12 PM MDT up reply actions
I wouldn't give up Hammel.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Webb is the best home grown pitcher in franchusse history
He is a big deal in Arizona, and if they aren’t willing to bring him back even for sentimentality’s sake after all the close monitoring of his setbacks, I don’t see why we should have any greater motivation. I’d Webb would be a good bet to help their rotation even as a backend starter, he would be back
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Nov 3, 2010 1:41 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
1.5 Million at the parade? No...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Did they really just say that?
Was that a police estimate?
I actually wouldn’t be surprised if it was in the hundreds of thousands.
Amy G. keeps saying it. MLB Network guys are saying probably around 200,000
It’s probably somewhere around 400-500 thousand
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
And Glenn Beck had 1.5 million at his rally on the National Mall, too!
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
Aww...well good for Jeremy Affledt.....
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
More from Renck on catcher situation:
As for catcher, I was told by a couple of sources that John Buck not on Rockies’ radar. I know for fact that they like Napoli
I like Napoli too
Napoli > Olivo IMO
Yeah, my username says it all.
by CentralCaliRox on Nov 3, 2010 2:29 PM MDT up reply actions
Napoli had nice OBPs before this season
His mix of on-base plus power would be a pleasant departure from Olivo.
Dang, Barry Zito looks HAWT
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Too bad he has that horrible contract.
He would be a good lefty for us…and would help our HAR
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Huh, no Barry Bonds there...seems kinda weird...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Well, the Rockies were just mentioned ...at the parade.
For Darren Ford’s scramble on the 3 ft bunt single….that sucks…:(
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I'm pretty sure Arnold is a Dodger fan...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Wow...most everyone is booing Arnold...that's kind of rude...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I thought it a bit tacky.
He’s already leaving office. And he’s just supporting your team. No need to make it a referendum on his politics.
Yeah. I'm not an Arnold fan...but I wouldn't have booed him in this venue. Maybe another one...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
maybe the are saying
BOOOO-URNS
BOOOO-URNS
Hebrew National Hot Dogs - The Official Hot Dog of the Colorado Rockies.
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Heh.....nope
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
the playoffs were exciting, but if it felt like something was missing, there was
Out of all of the 33 playoff games, not a single one ended with a walkoff hit.
The last time that happened was 1989.
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Nov 3, 2010 2:58 PM MDT via mobile reply actions
Wow...now that's a cool stat. I'm thinking the Rockies will change that next year at Coors in Game 7.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
there was a walkoff sac fly
Ubaldo "Iron Arm" Jimenez
Seth Smith’s beard looks on in anticipation.
Zomtober!!!
Olivo but Octavio right?
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Nov 3, 2010 3:14 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
OH.MY.GOD....Huff just pulled the Thong out of his pants on TV...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
sort of like that scene in Zoolander?
Hebrew National Hot Dogs - The Official Hot Dog of the Colorado Rockies.
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Proud Member of the PR gynocracy.
Video tips on posting links and images to Purple Row - Click Here -
Exactly like the scene in Zoolander. And in fact, he said for those who've seen Zoolander..
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Clint Hurdle one of two finalists for the Pirates managing job
Jeff Banister is the other.
Good luck, Clint!
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
I don't know anything about Jeff Banister.
But I think Clint would be a really good choice for them.
It would be ironic that in the course of what ,3+years, the Rox and Pirates swap managers
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Yes, yes it would.
And Hurdle taking over pretty much exactly the kind of roster he inherited from Buddy Bell.
I hope he gets it. In game decision making aside, he’s a decent human being who I admire.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
Yup, Definitely agree.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Jeff Francis officially declined.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
Sigh..:( Does this mean he's gone or they will try to renegotiate?
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
We want him back on a cheaper deal.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 4:27 PM MDT up reply actions
Though there may be 5-6 teams that will be willing to take a shot on him at more guaranteed $$$ than the Rox want to offer
I think we’ve seen the last of The Physicist in a Rockies uniform.
This makes me sad.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
Ringolsby says Olivo was declined as well.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 4:30 PM MDT up reply actions
What are your thoughts about Torrealba coming back to the Rockies?
I know this would really please Cat..:)
He's going to be seeking money more than what I'd want to put towards Chris Iannetta's backup.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 4:34 PM MDT up reply actions
Torrey a little costly
True. But he was a good clutch hitter – something the Rockies did not have the latter half of this last season.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 5:44 PM MDT up reply actions
costly?
..and now ringolsby tweets olivo’s option declined …my horribly naive opinion is that the rockies have now let go of two …well …look how sad it is if you find olivo and torrealba on this list (note the minimum PA of 220 in the link)
http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=c&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=220&type=6&season=2010&month=0
Heh..it would, but I doubt that would happen.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Also, I've accepted that will not see Torrey or Hawpe in a Rockies jersey again...
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Hawpe gone forever
Hawpe was quite good at one time. His fade was alarming and discouraging. Suppose he had some sort of unlisted injury. Maybe he will reemerge eventually out in Baltimore.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 5:47 PM MDT up reply actions
Baltimore? I thought he was still with the Rays?
Yeah, Hawpe was my favorite Rockie ever. I hope he does well again.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I believe this poster was being hypothetical about Baltimore.
Rays will not bring Hawpe back.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:53 PM MDT up reply actions
Olivo gone too?
Anybody know why they non-tendered Olivo? Surely they do not expect CDI to produce at needed levels.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 5:42 PM MDT up reply actions
They didn't non-tender him.
They declined his option. They clearly feel they can do better at C.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:49 PM MDT up reply actions
Who they got?
Ok, but wonder who this mystery catcher is. It ain’t CDI. McKenry ain’t got it either. They got somebody decent no one has seen before?
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 6:12 PM MDT up reply actions
Iannetta has the ability to do better
He did in 2008
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Nov 3, 2010 6:17 PM MDT up reply actions
So, with the free agents leaving, here is our projected roster for next season as of today.
Use this as a standard for where we need to get to via free agency before 2011 gates open.
C Chris Iannetta
C Michael McKenry
1B Todd Helton
2B Eric Young Jr.
SS Troy Tulowitzki
3B Ian Stewart
IF Chris Nelson
OF Carlos Gonzalez
OF Dexter Fowler
OF Ryan Spilborghs
OF Seth Smith
OF Cole Garner
UT Clint Barmes (Likely non-tender, replaced by Jonathan Herrera)
SP Ubaldo Jimenez
SP Jhoulys Chacin
SP Jason Hammel
SP Aaron Cook
SP Esmil Rogers
RP Huston Street
RP Rafael Betancourt
RP Matt Belisle
RP Manny Delcarmen
RP Franklin Morales
RP Matt Reynolds
RP Matt Daley
Three months from now this should look a lot different.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
Needs more Jorge De La Rosa
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Needs more lots of things.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 4:54 PM MDT up reply actions
This is true.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I don't know about "lots"
though I guess that’s tough to define. Replace McKenry with Napoli (or someone like that), switch EY with Nelson, replace Garner with Willingham (or Mora, or someone), JDLR for Rogers, and Rogers for Daley and keep ‘em all healthy…I’m feeling ready for war. Maybe that is “lots” but it doesn’t feel that far away.
Bringing in Napoli, Willingham AND de la Rosa would probably be defined as "lots"
Maybe two of them
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Nov 3, 2010 5:52 PM MDT up reply actions
I don't want to see Daley, McKenry or Garner on the team to start.
Nor Nelson unless he’s starting. Rogers and Morales are on the bubble too, but are more complicated cases.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 4:56 PM MDT up reply actions
Why no Daley?
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Easily replaceable for similarly cheap but higher end bullpen talent.
Daley is a lot like Ryan Speier of 2007. He’s a pitcher who can pitch MLB innings without embarrassing himself, but isn’t a standout candidate for even a seventh man in the pen. I see Daley as the guy who is up when someone else is hurt or struggling. I want one more bullpen pitcher on that list who can provide more.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:15 PM MDT up reply actions
So 2009 Daley is but a memory for you, and pre injury Daley?
I disagree.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
In 2009, Daley was playing exactly the role I described above.
Matt Daley has never once been on the Rockies as anything other than a placeholder for somebody else (discounting Sept. rosters)
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:21 PM MDT up reply actions
Placeholder? He was a darn serviceable 7th inning/setup guy in 2009.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I never said he wasn't servicable. If I thought that, I wouldn't even want him on the roster.
Daley did work 7th innings in 2009 (rarely 8ths, but occasionally when behind), but his role was relatively undefined. This is not a personal attack on Daley. It’s an understanding that we can have a better pitcher there for the same cost.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:29 PM MDT up reply actions
I'm not sure of that...I think Daley was very good, especially considering he was a rookie in 09.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Daley was much better than anybody projected. I like him.
That doesn’t mean we should neglect improving the bullpen for his benefit. Daley would not have even made the team in 2009 at any point (even September, he was not considered a prospect at the time and was called up because he got off to a wicked start with the Springs) were it not for Buchholz’ surgery, Belisle’s ineffectiveness, stupid decisions with Morillo and Daley Mark 1.0 Ryan Speier unable to stay healthy.
Daley more than satisfied in a depleted pen. I say he should be given every opportunity to do the same thing. He’s just not worth saving a spot for, IMO.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:34 PM MDT up reply actions
Daley was a nice player
but I think WM’s point is well-taken, he was hardly an outlier and overall his talent level suggests that he’s not a guy you build around. He’s a guy you end up with. And for that, he’s good.
I probably should have waited to read your post
as you mirror my thoughts pretty closely. I like Rogers and hope we keep him. Morales I can give or take, but I’m willing to buy in for one more year.
By my calculations, Rogers should have a fourth option year as Reynolds does, but nobody's mentioned it yet.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:22 PM MDT up reply actions
3 months
Thanks to the WolfMan for laying this all out. Hopefully what they end up with in three months is a much stronger overall group.
by Real Perspective on Nov 3, 2010 5:41 PM MDT up reply actions
I see only two people
that could possibly play 1B. I think that will change shortly (or not shortly).
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~Art Hill
JFK
Greinke's trade list is weird.
I think he has to actually select the teams when prompted, with one or two exceptions.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 4:58 PM MDT up reply actions
I think I read that he wants no part of the Yankees (on Mets)
Which is kind of silly as the Yankees are a pretty safe playoff bet, year in and out.
Go Bruce!
Given the way he's spoken before (in a non-specific manner)
I’m fairly certain the Rox are not on his no-trade list.
However, considering Dayton Moore, I think there is little to zero chance we can pull off a trade for Greinke, as Moore would likely want something like Chacin AND Iannetta, and trading Chacin for Greinke benefits us in no way at all.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
Given Greinke's personality (known as shy, reclusive and introverted)...
… I can totally understand why Greinke wouldn’t want to be going to super-stressful media heavy markets.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:16 PM MDT up reply actions
It's more than just him being shy. He was treated for social anxiety disorder.
like Khalil Greene. I think it would be a disaster for him. And honesly, the Denver sports media is just as ravenous as NY since the Broncos suck now, the Rockies are most likely to be the targets for ravening,
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
Yes, I'm aware of Greinke's history.
the Denver sports media is just as ravenous as NY since
You forget that the national media bombards the Yankees of the world with attention while ignoring the Rockies of the world. Believe me, Greinke’s experience here would be MUCH healthier for him than somewhere northeast.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:24 PM MDT up reply actions
It would better comparatively. But seriously, you don't think Denver media is pretty harsh
for a “mid” market town. I’m not joking. The first time Grienke blows Kizsla will write something vile that might destroy the guy.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
You might be right that Denver's market is harsh relative to mid-markets
but I doubt it cracks the top 10 in baseball overall, if that. And comparing it to NY, frankly, is not a winning argument.
"Harsh" in the sense that it has a lot of naggy people, maybe.
It’s still one fifteenth the size, and a whole lot less active. This isn’t so much about the content of what is written about him, but the amount of attention he will receive, both locally and nationally. Both of these will be incredibly smaller than all large-market teams, and many mid-market teams too, because of our isolation.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:36 PM MDT up reply actions
I also think we could get more attention because of Grienke.
Especially if he goes off like he did a couple of years ago. Of course, it wouldn’t be the sheer volume, but the vitriol is the same.
2011 Colorado Zombies--Will rise from beneath homeplate with the shards of a broken season in Tulo's hand!
Brad Hawpe - Thanks Brad, you were a class act.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy
I consider that a moot point, though, because Greinke already gets built-in Greinke attention regardless of where he goes.
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"The highest form of human excellence is to question oneself and others." - Socrates
by Greg Stanwood on Nov 3, 2010 5:39 PM MDT up reply actions
No, Denver's not really harsh at all
Paige and Kiszla are abject idiots, but their level of harshness can’t even begin to touch those in some other cities.
So let's just win 12 more games next year, mmmkay?
Will the Gints complain about the non-humidor balls in Citizens Bank Ballpark when they lose there, too?
We won't get an impact bat at this rate...
We will over pay for Bedard and Bard.
"Why are they outlawin' the spit pitch? The curveball is a cheap 'n easy pitch; the spitter aint" Ty Cobb
"When I was pitching 90's in the seventies; I never thought I'd be pitching 70's in the nineties!" Frank Tanana
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