OT: Historinerd Thread
Happy birthday, Muzia! Here's your present I promised you last night: the thread everyone's been waiting for since the beginning of the offseason. The one where we go all historical on everyone who chooses to participate. To start us off, here is a list of all the books I have read since 2007 (the list goes from recent to earliest):
| Title | Author |
|---|---|
| Secret of State: The State Department & the Struggle Over U.S. Foreign Policy | Barry Rubin |
| Clinton's Secret Wars: The Evolution of a Commander in Chief | Richard Sale |
| Uses of Force and Wilsonian Foreign Policy | Frederick S. Calhoun |
| Elusive Quest: America's Pursuit of European Stability and French Security 1919-1933 | Melvyn P. Leffler |
| Power and Principle: Armed Intervention in Wilsonian Foreign Policy | Frederick S. Calhoun |
| D-Day 1944 (Modern War Studies) | Theodore A. Wilson |
| Lincoln and the Decision for War: The Northern Response to Secession | Russell A. McClintock |
| Bitter Victory: The Battle for Sicily 1943 | Carlo D'Este |
| Wilson and His Peacemakers: American Diplomacy at the Paris Peace Conference 1919 | Arthur Walworth |
| Paris 1919: Six Months That Changed the World | Margaret Macmillan |
| Paths to Power: The Historiography of American Foreign Relations to 1941 | Michael J. Hogan (ed.) |
| American Reparations to Germany 1919-33: Implications for the Third | Stephen A. Schuker |
| The Last Years of the Monroe Doctrine 1945-1993 | Gaddis Smith |
| Ideology and U.S. Foreign Policy | Michael H. Hunt |
| John Quincy Adams and American Global Empire | William Earl Weeks |
| War Without Mercy: Race and Power in the Pacific War | John W. Dower |
| Closing With the Enemy: How GIs Fought the War in Europe 1944-1945 (Modern War Studies) | Michael D. Doubler |
| Creating the Secret State: The Origins of the Central Intelligence Agency 1943-1947 | David F. Rudgers |
| The CIA in Guatemala: The Foreign Policy of Intervention | Richard H. Immerman |
| American Soldiers: Ground Combat in the World Wars Korea and Vietnam | Peter S. Kindsvatter |
| The Policy Makers: Shaping American Foreign Policy from 1947 to the Present | Anna Kasten Nelson |
| Warrior's Rage: The Great Tank Battle of 73 Easting | Douglas A. Macgregor |
| Rumsfeld's Wars: The Arrogance of Power (Modern War Studies) | Dale R. Herspring |
| Crossroads of Decision: The State Department and Foreign Policy 1933-1937 | Howard Jablon |
| Quartermaster General of the Union Army: A Biography of M.C. Meigs | Russell Frank Weigley |
| The Sword of the Republic: The United States Army on the Frontier 1783-1846 | Francis Paul Prucha |
| The Muslim-Croat Civil War in Central Bosnia: A Military History 1992-1994 | Charles R. Shrader |
| Secret Agencies: U.S. Intelligence in a Hostile World | Loch K. Johnson |
| America's Army: Making the All-Volunteer Force | Beth Bailey |
| West Pointers and the Civil War: The Old Army in War and Peace (Civil War America) | Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh |
| U. S. Grant: American Hero American Myth (Civil War America) | Joan C. Waugh |
| Power and Purpose: U.S. Policy Toward Russian After the Cold War | James M. Goldgeier |
| The New Military Humanism: Lessons from Kosovo | Noam Chomsky |
| Armed Progressive: General Leonard Wood | Jack C. Lane |
| Midnight Diaries | Boris Yeltsin |
| A Question of Command: Counterinsurgency from the Civil War to Iraq | Mark Moyar |
| The Road to Independence for Kosovo: A Chronicle of the Ahtisaari Plan | Henry H. Perritt Jr. |
| Civilian in Peace Soldier in War: The Army National Guard 1636-2000 (Modern War Studies) | Michael D. Doubler |
| Technology and the American Way of War Since 1945 | Thomas G. Mahnken |
| Russia and the Balkans: Foreign Policy from Yeltsin to Putin | James Headley |
| Madam Secretary: A Memoir | Madeleine Albright |
| Learning to Eat Soup with a Knife: Counterinsurgency Lessons from Malaya and Vietnam | John A. Nagl |
| Slobodan Milosevic and the Destruction of Yugoslavia | Louis Sell |
| First Do No Harm: Humanitarian Intervention and the Destruction of Yugoslavia | David N. Gibbs |
| Not Whether but When: The U.S. Decision to Enlarge NATO | James M. Goldgeier |
| Just And Unjust Wars: A Moral Argument With Historical Illustrations | Michael Walzer |
| Kosovo: War and Revenge | Tim Judah |
| The Lessons and Non-Lessons of the Air and Missile Campaign in Kosovo | Anthony H. Cordesman |
| Collision Course: NATO Russia and Kosovo | John Norris |
| Soldiers and Scholars: The U.S. Army and the Uses of Military History 1865-1920 (Modern War Studies) | Carol Reardon |
| The Eagle and the Lion: The Tragedy of American-Iranian Relations | James A. Bill |
| In the Trenches at Petersburg: Field Fortifications and Confederate Defeat (Civil War America) | Earl J. Hess |
| Field Armies and Fortifications in the Civil War: The Eastern Campaigns 1861-1864 (Civil War America) | Earl J. Hess |
| Trench Warfare under Grant and Lee: Field Fortifications in the Overland Campaign (Civil War America) | Earl J. Hess |
| The Antietam Campaign (Military Campaigns of the Civil War) | Gary Gallagher (ed.) |
| NATO's Empty Victory | Ted Galen Carpenter |
| The Art of Military Coercion: Why the West's Military Superiority Scarcely Matters | Rob de Wijk |
| The Kosovo Crisis: The Last American War in Europe? | Stanley Henig |
| Kosovo: How Myths and Truths Started a War | Julie A. Mertus |
| Peace at Any Price: How the World Failed Kosovo (Crises in World Politics) | Iain King |
| Second Chance: Three Presidents and the Crisis of American Superpower | Zbigniew Brzezinski |
| The Foreign Policy Of Russia: Changing Systems Enduring Interests | Robert H. Donaldson |
| The Psychological Impact of War Trauma on Civilians: An International Perspective | Various |
| Postmodern War: The New Politics of Conflict | Chris Hables Gray |
| The Legacy of George W. Bush's Foreign Policy: Moving beyond Neoconservatism | Ilan Peleg |
| America Between the Wars: From 11/9 to 9/11 | Derek Chollet |
| US Foreign Policy in the Twenty-First Century: Gulliver's Travails (Dilemmas in World Politics) | J. Martin Rochester |
| The Limits of Power: The End of American Exceptionalism | Andrew Bacevich |
| America in the World: The Historiography of US Foreign Relations since 1941 | Michael J. Hogan (ed.) |
| The U.S. Marines and Amphibious War | Jeter A. Isley |
| Kosovo Liberation Army: The Inside Story of an Insurgency | Henry H. Perritt |
| Kosovo: What Everyone Needs to Know | Tim Judah |
| Awkward Dominion: American Political Economic and Cultural Relations With Europe 1919-1933 | Frank Costigliola |
| Lee and His Army in Confederate History (Civil War America) | Gary W. Gallagher |
| How the States Got Their Shapes | Mark Stein |
| Invasion of Japan: Alternative to the Bomb | John Ray Skates |
| The Kosovo Conflict and International Law: An Analytical Documentation 1974-1999 | Heike Krieger (ed.) |
| Curious Events in History | Michael Powell |
| Tried by War: Abraham Lincoln as Commander in Chief | James M. McPherson |
| NATO's Gamble: Combining Diplomacy and Airpower in the Kosovo Crisis 1998-1999 | Dag Henriksen |
| Blitzkrieg to Desert Storm: The Evolution of Operational Warfare | Robert M. Citino |
| NATO's Balkan Interventions | Dana H. Allin |
| War Over Kosovo | Andrew Bacevich (ed.) |
| The First World War | Hew Strachan |
| Colossus: The Rise and Fall of the American Empire | Niall Ferguson |
| That Noble Dream: The 'Objectivity Question' and the American Historical Profession (Ideas in Context) | Peter Novick |
| The German Way of War: From the Thirty Years' War to the Third Reich (Modern War Studies) | Robert M. Citino |
| Frontier Regulars: The United States Army and the Indian 1866-1891 | Robert M. Utley |
| On War | Carl von Clausewitz |
| The Road to Rainbow: Army Planning for Global War 1934-1940 | Henry G. Gole |
| The Rifle Musket in Civil War Combat: Reality and Myth (Modern War Studies) | Earl J. Hess |
| The Soviet-Afghan War: How a Superpower Fought and Lost | Lester W. Grau and Michael A. Gress (eds.) |
| Black Southerners in Confederate Armies | Someone |
| Fast Tanks and Heavy Bombers: Innovation in the U.S. Army 1917-1945 | David E. Johnson |
| The Battle of Kursk | David M. Glantz |
| Black Confederates and Afro-Yankees in Civil War Virginia | Ervin L. Jordan Jr. |
| The Gray and the Black: The Confederate Debate on Emancipation | Robert F. Durden |
| Battle Tactics of the Civil War (Yale Nota Bene) | Paddy Griffith |
| Fighting for Defeat: Union Military Failure in the East 1861-1865 | Michael C.C. Adams |
| This Republic of Suffering: Death and the American Civil War | Drew Gilpin Faust |
| Race and Reunion: The Civil War in American Memory | David W. Blight |
| Ornamentalism: How the British Saw Their Empire | David Cannadine |
| Drawn with the Sword: Reflections on the American Civil War | James M. McPherson |
| Upon the Altar of the Nation: A Moral History of the Civil War | Harry S. Stout |
| This Terrible Sound: THE BATTLE OF CHICKAMAUGA | Peter Cozzens |
| The Philippine War 1899-1902 (Modern War Studies) | Brian McAllister Linn |
| The Korean War | William Stueck |
| Dereliction of Duty: Johnson McNamara the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Lies That Led to Vietnam | H. R. McMaster |
| The New American Militarism: How Americans Are Seduced by War | Andrew J. Bacevich |
| Eisenhower's Lieutenants: The Campaign of France and Germany 1944-1945 | Russell F. Weigley |
| A Great Civil War: A Military and Political History 1861-1865 | Russell F. Weigley |
| Gettysburg | Stephen W. Sears |
| The Ideology of the Offensive: Military Decision Making and the Disasters of 1914 | Jack L. Snyder |
| Crossing the Deadly Ground: United States Army Tactics 1865-1899 | Perry D. Jamieson |
| Civil War Leadership and Mexican War Experience | Kevin Dougherty |
| Confederates in the Attic: Dispatches from the Unfinished Civil War | Tony Horwitz |
| From Cape Charles to Cape Fear: The North Atlantic Blockading Squadron during the Civil War (Fire Ant) | Robert Browning Jr |
| The Roots of Blitzkrieg: Hans von Seeckt and German Military Reform | James S. Corum |
| The Echo of Battle: The Army's Way of War | Brian McAllister Linn |
| War Plan Orange: The U.S. Strategy to Defeat Japan 1897-1945 | Edward S. Miller |
| World History of Warfare (Tactics & Strategies) | Christon I. Archer |
| Reconstruction: America's Unfinished Revolution 1863-1877 | Eric Foner |
| Confederate Emancipation: Southern Plans to Free and Arm Slaves during the Civil War | Bruce Levine |
| Lee Considered: General Robert E. Lee and Civil War History | Alan T. Nolan |
| Fort Pillow A Civil War Massacre And Public Memory | John Cimprich |
| Cities of the Dead: Contesting the Memory of the Civil War in the South 1865-1914 (Civil War America) | William Blair |
| Battle Cry of Freedom: The Civil War Era (Oxford History of the United States) | James M. McPherson |
| The Hard Hand of War | Mark Grimsley |
| The War I Always Wanted: The Illusion of Glory and the Reality of War | Brandon Friedman |
| The War of 1812: A FORGOTTEN CONFLICT | Donald R. Hickey |
| The GI Offensive in Europe: The Triumph of American Infantry Divisions 1941-1945 (Modern War Studies) | Peter R. Mansoor |
| Virtual War: Kosovo and Beyond | Michael Ignatieff |
| The Peace of Illusions: American Grand Strategy from 1940 to the Present | Christopher Layne |
| Women in the Third Reich (Arnold Publication) | Matthew Stibbe |
| Reluctant Crusaders: Power Culture and Change in American Grand Strategy | Colin Dueck |
| A Problem from Hell: America and the Age of Genocide | Samantha Power |
| 1943: THE VICTORY THAT NEVER WAS | John Grigg |
| Winning Ugly: Nato's War to Save Kosovo | Ivo H. Daalder |
| Alexander of Macedon 356-323 B.C.: A Historical Biography | Peter Green |
| O'er the Land of the Free | Samuel Lombardo |
| Chancellorsville | Stephen W. Sears |
| Getting to Dayton: The Making of America's Bosnia Policy | Ivo H. Daalder |
| Alexander The Great: The Invisible Enemy | John Maxwell O'Brien |
| Nazi Seizure of Power: The Experience of a Single German Town 1922-1945 | William Allen |
| The Nature of Alexander | Mary Renault |
| Quest for Decisive Victory: From Stalemate to Blitzkrieg in Europe 1899-1940 | Robert M. Citino |
| Alexander The Great | J.R. Hamilton |
| To End All Wars: Woodrow Wilson and the Quest for a New World Order | Thomas J. Knock |
| The World Is Flat [Updated and Expanded]: A Brief History of the Twenty-first Century | Thomas L. Friedman |
| Inside Delta Force: The Story of America's Elite Counterterrorist Unit | Eric Haney |
| The True Believer: Thoughts on the Nature of Mass Movements (Perennial Classics) | Eric Hoffer |
| Manifest Destiny: American Expansion and the Empire of Right (Critical Issue Book) | Anders Stephanson |
| 15 Stars: Eisenhower MacArthur Marshall: Three Generals Who Saved the American Century | Stanley Weintraub |
| The Cold War Era (Problems in American History) | Fraser J. Harbutt |
| Henry Cabot Lodge and the Search for an American Foreign Policy | William C. Widenor |
| War Is a Racket: The Anti-War Classic by America's Most Decorated General | Smedley D. Butler |
| The Utility of Force: The Art of War in the Modern World | Rupert Smith |
| Lincoln and Chief Justice Taney: Slavery Secession and the President's War Powers | James F. Simon |
| Calendar: Humanity's Epic Struggle to Determine a True and Accurate Year | David Ewing Duncan |
| Pickett's Charge in History and Memory | Carol Reardon |
| The One Percent Doctrine: Deep Inside America's Pursuit of Its Enemies Since 9/11 | Ron Suskind |
| Cobra II: The Inside Story of the Invasion and Occupation of Iraq | Michael R. Gordon |
| Fiasco: The American Military Adventure in Iraq | Thomas E. Ricks |
| The Jugurthine War / The Conspiracy of Catiline | Sallust |
| The Rise of the Roman Empire | Polybius |
| Lives of the Later Caesars | A. Birley (Introduction Translator) |
| On War (Oxford World's Classics) | Carl von Clausewitz |
| Khubilai Khan: His Life and Times | Morris Rossabi |
| The Strange Death of Liberal England 1910-1914 | George Dangerfield |
| Queen Victoria's Gene (Pocket Biographies) | D.M. Potts |
| John Adams | David McCullough |
| Silent Night: The Story of the World War I Christmas Truce | Stanley Weintraub |
| War in a Time of Peace: Bush Clinton and the Generals | David Halberstam |
| Rise Of The Vulcans: The History of Bush's War Cabinet | James Mann |
| The Road to Disunion: Volume I: Secessionists at Bay 1776-1854 (Road to Disunion Vol. 1) | William W. Freehling |
| Explaining the History of American Foreign Relations | Michael J. Hogan and Thomas G. Paterson (eds.) |
| The Wilsonian Century: U.S. Foreign Policy since 1900 | Frank Ninkovich |
| The Warrior and the Priest: Woodrow Wilson and Theodore Roosevelt | John Milton Cooper Jr. |
| Strategies of Dominance: The Misdirection of U.S. Foreign Policy (Woodrow Wilson Center Press) | P. Edward Haley |
| Maus I: A Survivor's Tale: My Father Bleeds History | Art Spiegelman |
| Maus II: A Survivor's Tale: And Here My Troubles Began (Maus) | Art Spiegelman |
| A World at Arms: A Global History of World War II New Edition | Gerhard L. Weinberg |
| Among The Dead Cities: The History and Moral Legacy of the WWII Bombing of Civilians in Germany and Japan | A.C. Grayling |
| On Strategy: A Critical Analysis of the Vietnam War | Harry G. Summers |
| The American Way of War: A History of United States Military Strategy and Policy | Russell F. Weigley |
| The Civil War: A History | Harry Hansen |
| One Hell of a Gamble: Khrushchev Castro and Kennedy 1958-1964 | Aleksandr Fursenko |
| A Preponderance of Power: National Security the Truman Administration and the Cold War | Melvyn Leffler |
| The Tragedy of American Diplomacy | William Appleman Williams |
| With the Old Breed: At Peleliu and Okinawa | E. B. Sledge; Introduction-Paul Fussell |
| A Time to Lead: For Duty Honor and Country | Wesley K. Clark |
| To End a War (Modern Library Paperbacks) | Richard Holbrooke |
| Ordinary Men: Reserve Police Battalion 101 and the Final Solution in Poland | Christopher R. Browning |
| Ivan's War: Life and Death in the Red Army 1939-1945 | Catherine Merridale |
| Waging Modern War: Bosnia Kosovo and the Future of Combat | Wesley K. Clark |
Eat. Drink. Be Merry. But the above FanPost does not necessarily reflect the attitudes, opinions, or views of Purple Row's staff (unless, of course, it's written by the staff [and even then, it still might not]).
349 comments
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LOL
the SBNation software links the work Yankees in Black Confederates and Afro-Yankees in Civil War Virginia to the baseball team….
Anyway thatnks for this…and on a work-from-home day for me too!!!
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
That's
why the auto-tagger asked me if I wanted the Yankees associated with this story.
Snow day for me, even though I’m off from work today, anyway.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
I can't believe this thread had zero recs?
Donate to charity by shopping for Purple Row Merchandise at:
Purple Row Cares
We don't have time for recs.
We only have time to debate history.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
So Russ
since we were briefly discussing Wilson last week…
What are your thoughts on the League of Nations? Was there any chance that the United States would have supported entry into such a league had Wilson handled the domestic situation differently?
Attention Whore.
I've heard
one PhD student of the Progressive Era argue that had Wilson not had his stroke, the speaking tour of the States he planned may have produced an acceptable outcome.
Also, if you delve into Widenor’s biography of Henry Cabot Lodge, you’ll see that Wilson and Lodge weren’t substantially different on the League. Article 10, collective security, was the main problem. Had Wilson been a bit more pliable on Lodge’s and others’ reservation on that, maybe.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
I knew Lodge was a proponent of the idea
Wilson may have been too rigid in his demands, too many enemies in Congress to truly make it happen, stroke or no.
Attention Whore.
It didn't help
that he took no Republicans with him to Paris.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
It seems to me (and again, this is not my area of study)
is that the isolationist nature of Americans would have stopped participation in the League regardless. The only reason we overcame that after the 2nd world war was that we had become the critical piece. After WWI, we were still (at best) a regional power, not a world power.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
that was a major reason for Wilson's tour
it was really the first time a President had traveled across the country to appeal to the citizens, instead of directly to Congress, and was a monumental shift into modern politics. (FDR drew directly from this strategy)
I hold quite a bit of respect for Wilson, despite his flaws. He essentially killed himself trying to persuade people to do the correct thing.
Attention Whore.
Sure, but Lindbergh and others
were MUCH more sucessful because their message was aimed at re-inforcing existing attitudes, rather than trying to change who Americans basically are.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
it certainly wasn't a success
but it laid some very important groundwork. Wilson was the first president to identify that his power came from public support and actively sought out to gain that approval in order to hold sway over his opponents in Congress
Attention Whore.
Hmmm, I need to think about that.
Sounds right; now I need to figure out if that’s an improvement or not!
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
there's a gap between Wilson's first attempt and FDR
but the similarities are certainly there. I don’t know if Coolidge or Hoover had the ability (or Harding the drive) to reach out to the public in the same way. In many respects, Wilson was the first Modern President.
Attention Whore.
That isolationist
sentiment is a bit overblown. Treaty of Portsmouth, aiding a revolution for an independent Panama, the Algeciras Conference, and Far East Asia during Roosevelt’s time. Wilson and Mexico.
It’s really about being politically uninvolved in European continental affairs for the isolationists.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
More than overblown
It’s a complete myth.
The United States military has always been used as an interventionist force. Up until the First World War the United States military intervened outside the borders of the United States something like 150 times in places as close as Florida and Cuba to places as far flung as Fiji.
there is a major difference between Monroe Doctrine intervention
and signing up as part of a worldwide police force. There was still isolationist sentiment towards Europe at the time.
Attention Whore.
I would just differentiate between practice and popular sentiment.
Even when fighting in “popular” wars, the American public has always wanted it’s troops to return home quickly; sometimes with disasterous effect.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
I'd argue that's not uniquely American
Total war has almost always led to weariness amongst civilian populations in modern Western societies.
Now, that’s something quite different than having expeditionary forces fight to expand influence which has also been historically very popular amongst civilian populations in modern Western societies.
The United States has never been somehow apart from that tradition, it has always had expeditionary forces fighting to expand territorially and in influence across the globe.
OK, here's a starting topic for me to exhibit some ignorance...
I read somewhere else on the internet a claim that McClellan’s lack of aggressiveness can be partially explained by poor intellegence provided by Pinkerton, who may have had traitorous motives (at at least had Confederate sympathies)
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
Never heard that before.
I attribute McClellan’s “lack of aggressiveness” to his policies of conciliation. He believed the South needed to be treated properly in the conduct of war, and after Antietam he was no longer in vogue as Lincoln turned to a policy of hard war (i.e., Grant, Sherman, Sheridan).
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Hsieh alludes to his conduct of the war as well...
as being part of the influence of West Point, and it’s efforts to professionalize the army.
I know you haven’t read it, but The Best School in the World presents some statistical evidence that USMA did a better job of producing loyal southern officers than the regular army did.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
True,
the professionalization also placed some limits on how the generals conducted themselves, but McClellan, while a professional soldier, was also a soldier with political ambitions.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
wasn't he planning to run for president
or was that just Hancock?
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
He did run in 64
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
Hancock ran for president too after the war right?
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
1880
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
That's actually a pretty interesting election...
close popular vote, highly regionalized….
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winfield_Scott_Hancock#Election_of_1880
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
Interesting note of the 1876 election that I had never heard before...
“Colorado had become the 38th state on August 1, 1876. With insufficient time and money to organize a presidential election in the new state, Colorado’s state legislature selected the state’s electors. These electors in turn gave their three votes to Hayes and the Republican Party.”
We don’t need no stinkin’ elections!
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
heh
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
yeah that was really close
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
I bet Garfield wishes it had swung the other direction...
Attention Whore.
by Muzia on Feb 10, 2010 9:02 AM MST up reply actions 1 recs
haha
man I actually laughed out loud on that one
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
if you haven't read it
Sarah Vowell’s “Assassination Vacation” is wonderful. It’s a short novel about her fascination with presidential assassins and the vacations she has taken to each of the historic sites.
Highly recommended, it’s a lot of fun
Attention Whore.
yeah that sound interesrting
I would like to know more about Garfield and Mckinley’s. It’s weird that most Americans don’t even realize that we had more than two presidents assinated. If Mckinley never got assasinated then Teddy never becomes president and I think America would be very different today.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
completely agree
I love that Teddy was “hidden” in the Vice President role so he would stay out of the way, and then becomes the youngest (and most enigmatic) president our country had seen.
Attention Whore.
yeah
they just made him Vice President so that he would never become president. Ha did that plan ever backfire.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
Just added it to my list
Thanks for the reccomendation!
Would love to get other ideas on stuff to read. I’ll add a recommendation of my own soon.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
if you are interested in presidential elections
“1912” by James Chace is incredible. He breaks down each of the four candidates and the dynamics of the election as a whole.
Attention Whore.
I'd also
recommend Four Hats in the Ring: The 1912 Election and the Birth of Modern American Politics by Lewis L. Gould. Read good reviews of it.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
I suspect lots of president end up regretting their "victory"
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
So, this leads to another topic that your list inspired...
I noticed a couple of Wes Clark titles. As you may remeber, MacGregor in Warrior’s rage doesn’t have much good to say about Gen. Clark as a soldier. Is he in the McClellan mold?
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
Interesting comparison
to make. However, Clark was trying to make the best of a bad situation. McClellan, on the other hand, used the actual conduct of the war to enhance his political career.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
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"Clark was trying to make the best of a bad situation"
Is this a refence to Kuwait or Kosovo? (or both?)
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
Kosovo. Clark
didn’t take part in Desert Storm. He was in charge of the National Training Center.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
OK, I'm obviously thinking of someone else that MacGregor criticized then
Didn’t Petreus later run the NTC? Or am I thinking of someone else from The Forth Star? It’s at Ft. leavenworth, KS, right?
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
NTC is at
Fort Irwin, California. That’s where they do Desert Training.
Ft. Leavenworth is home to the US Army Command and General Staff, which Petraues was in charge of a few years ago.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
interesting thread
Even though I won’t be able to contribute to this, I don’t feel that I now enough about history to do so, I really enjoy reading what you all have to say on the various events you are bringing up…plan to stalk…urr…read this one on a regular basis…thanks for starting it Russ!
Ninety feet between home plate and first base may be the closest man has ever come to perfection. ~Red Smith
ask a question if you have something you were always curious about
I’m sure one of us has studied it closely
Attention Whore.
I cannot match the depth of knowledge of military history it seems Russ has
My study has been very broad based and my actual research work has all been in social history. I’m currently working in the History of Sport.
One of the more interesting (and relevant to Purple Row) pieces I’ve read over the past few months was an article about why Americans chose to play baseball instead of Cricket as other British colonial possessions.
Here’s a slice from the abstract along with a citation:
Majumdar, Boria and Sean Brown. 2007. Why baseball, why cricket? differing nationalisms, differing challenges. International Journal of the History of Sport. 24(2):139-156. < http://www.informaworld.com/10.1080/09523360601045732 >. (accessed 10 February 2010).
In India, the nationalist movement from the close of the nineteenth century made it imperative that cricket be taken up as a non-violent means to compete with the ruling British. In the United States, where independence was achieved a century and a half earlier than India, this need was totally irrelevant. Rather, what was important in the US was to sever all sporting connections with the empire to emphasize an independent American identity. It is this inverse invocation of nationalism, we have argued, that best provides the key to unwinding the old dichotomy, Why Baseball Why Cricket? in differing global contexts.
American theatre took a very similar turn away from everything "British" and at around the same time as baseball
Melodrama may not be high art, but it was uniquely American. In fact, it seems all of popular entertainment had similar movements at about the same time…hmmmm…this is something I should look into.
Thanks for the abstract, I will be ordering that shortly.
Attention Whore.
actually, I have access to the full text article right now
thanks again, hopefully I will read this today
Attention Whore.
No problem
I’d be interesting to see what you think of the argument as a whole.
I personally think it is somewhat strained and somewhat removes British agency for the proliferation of Cricket as an imperial sport.
Still a very interesting article.
I think he makes a very interesting point at the end about NASCAR and the NFL
and I agree with his premise on the American side. The Manifest Destiny fire raged in many directions, and entertainment (especially baseball) seemed to be a product of that. Again, the similarities between this and the development of American theatre at the same time have to be linked. I really need to take a closer look at this phenomenon.
Thanks for the link, that was a great read.
Attention Whore.
Waterloo
I have been reading Les Miserables and Victor hugo devoted a whole big chapter to the battle of Waterloo. I really did not know much about the battle before hand. But since I have been doing some research on it. Even watched the 1970’s classic movie which is pretty cool. I had no idea how Wellington had used the battlefield so tactifully to surprise the French. Also did not know that the battle was really won by the prussians showing up at the end of the battle. It’s a very interesting battle once you start to learn about it.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
I disagree about the Prussians winning the battle..
while Napoleon was pressed for time because of the arrival of the larger force, I believe his inability to capture the lower forts in the valley, especially Quatres-Bra, and Marshal Ney’s butchering of his cavalry lead to the ultimate defeat. Wellington consistently proved he was able to adapt to changing situations in the field (like having his infantry squares lie down behind the hill to avoid the artillery shot) proved he was a better commander than Napoleon.
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Can we have a historinerd thread on a baseball blog and not discuss..
Doubleday?
I love that there is a Colorado connection to the creation of the Doubleday myth. Spaulding’s "source’ was a Denver resident when he came forward.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I'll be the guy in a orange shirt EVERY Monday...Broncos are my team win or lose.
Books of interest
Sugarball: The American Game, the Dominican Dream.
The Tropic of Baseball: Baseball in the Dominican Republic
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
I'm not up to speed on 20th century military history
But if anyone has a question about the medieval time period, the High Middle Ages, or especially England 900-1800, I am over that like a fat kid on cake.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
coincidentally
In between comments I’m reading the chapter on the middle ages in Anna Clark’s Desire: A History of European Sexuality.
I’ve never been so glad to have been born in the 20th Century.
Silver, I'm reading a biography of Charles II right now
It’s a time I know next to nothing about, so it’s fascinating. I’m also reading a book on the history of British cuisine (stop laughing at the back, France) which is currently in the middle ages. Did you know 100% of British people in the dark ages had teeth worn to stumps by the grittiness of the bread?
I've actually studied the Restoration in some depth
(was planning to write a novel about that one). So I may be able to help if you come up with questions.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:39 AM MST up reply actions
Hmm
That sounds like an interesting book.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:42 AM MST up reply actions
ooh! Let's talk about English history
it’s been a couple of years since I discussed this with anyone.
Attention Whore.
We saved their asses twice last century.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
they are like the older brother who beat us up when we were young
but just made us tough. We grew up to be bigger and had to protect the family
Attention Whore.
War plans
and planned war are very different things. The military had a number of color plans.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
If you figured out the best way to punch me on the nose, and I found out about it
I’d be pretty miffed, even if you weren’t “seriously” considering it :)
Anyway, any possible credibility the US once had about aggressive wars is long gone, so can we al share the moral low ground on this one?
Yes.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Not much Russian,
but yes on 19th century America.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Up to 1500,
I can discuss a little. My professo for that are, Morris Rossabi, makes an appearance on the above list.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
are you familiar with the Taipeng Rebellion?
took place during the American Civil War, basically toppled the Qing dynasty. A school dropout had visions that he was Jesus’ brother and somehow organized the entire countryside (by persuasion or by force) in armed rebellion against the Chinese government.
Attention Whore.
Can't say that I am.
I didn’t take the second half of Chinese history.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
too bad
I find it fascinating, how this seemingly lazy man can organize and lead an army of millions of farmers against the admittedly vulnerable Chinese empire.
Attention Whore.
it reads as fiction because the situation is so implausible
you may find it interesting though, there are entire books of their military strategies and army organization.
“God’s Chinese Son” by Jonathan Spense is a very engaging account of the organization and military campaigns and structure of the group.
Attention Whore.
Woohoo
But where to start…?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:40 AM MST up reply actions
Well, I'm only about 1/4 of the way through it
And it’s pretty hefty, so, um, when I went away last week I took a couple of lighter books with me instead :)
So perhaps when I’ve finished it? My area of expertise (i.e. the areas where I know enough to not completely suck at talking about it) is the Tudor period, if that’s of interest.
The book I was going to write was about Mary Stuart
(the Mary in William and Mary). I’ll get back to it once this other project is finally done. I have a few chapters, and what I found interesting about creating the characters of Charles II and James was that they operate on completely different planes from the rest of England. They really do believe the prerogative of kings, and it makes you realise (as is usually the case) how foreign policy in those days was basically who the king had a grudge against, regardless of circumstances. (The Treaty of Dover, for example). And of course that was smack in the middle of the Parliamentary debates about the divine rights that kings were supposed to have, or rather not have.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:46 AM MST up reply actions
And of course
Charles and James were both giant manwhores. As far as that goes, it’s hard to decide who comes out on top (so to speak) — them or Henry I.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:48 AM MST up reply actions
To speak of crazy rules of sexuality, that is...
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:49 AM MST up reply actions
(re: above) Majumdar and Brown argue that the Doubleday myth was an attempt to erase the British roots of baseball to retroactively justify its perceived status as America’s past time.
I think it just may have been a story too tall not to pass on.
Historical Fiction
I am a huge fan of historical Fiction. I have read most of the Shaara books and Patrick Obrien’s Master and Commander series along with a bunch of other stuff, including Berard Cornwell stuff, and of course a lot of Michner. does anyone have any suggestions of other great historical fiction out there that you enjoyed?
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
Don't really like the stuff.
I do prefer alternate history, though.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Harry Turtledove?
read Guns of the South that was interesting. time travelers bring the South AK-47’s. Kind of crazy, he has that other string of books though that don’t involve time travelers just what if the South had won.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
Turtledove, Flint,
and I consider Philip Pullman’s work quasi-alternate history.
Turtledove’s Timeline-191 series is my favorite, but there are tons of problems with it.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Whats the first book in that series?
is it How Few Remain? been meaning to read that series.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
How Few Remain
is the first. That’s the best of them. The rest depends on how much you like the Confederate States of America becoming Nazi Germany.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
How about his Colonization series?
Aliens come to colonize Earth and interupt WWII.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
Passed on those.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Another Favorite
James Webb Emperor’s General, about the events immediately post WWII in Japan and the Phillipines. Focused a lot on MaCarthur and his take over of the Japanese government and the war crimes trials in the Phillipines.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 10:14 AM MST up reply actions
Well, I write historical fiction...?
If all goes well, you may be getting to read some of it fairly soon
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:50 AM MST up reply actions
yes indeed
book is currently being looked at by HarperCollins and Simon & Schuster, as far as I know.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:53 AM MST up reply actions
thats cool is it about the Normans as well?
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:11 AM MST up reply actions
Yeah
Half of it takes place in the 11th century during the years of William’s reign and right afterward (from 1066-1097) and half in 20th century Oxford.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:16 AM MST up reply actions
sounds cool
let us know if it gets published
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:25 AM MST up reply actions
oh I will
I may even freak out
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:43 AM MST up reply actions
I would so pick up Silver's book in a bookshop
If it has a good cover, anyway, ideally with the writing in olde-tyme type.
I would need a signed copy.
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I'm a huge Bernard Cornwell fan..
there’s a cool fansite of his at Hookton.
Donate to charity by shopping for Purple Row Merchandise at:
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His Lords of The North series is great
But his Richard Sharpe novels were the best
Belief that success is inevitable is as likely to hold you back as a belief that it is impossible.
Interesting
I thought it was the other way around i thought the Union joined Germany in WWI and WWII maybe I heard opposit. I will defintley have to check it out once I finish Les Mis.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
reply fail...
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 10:01 AM MST up reply actions
Not to spoil things,
but yes, the United States joins Germany. Germany doesn’t lose the war in Europe and the Kaiser stays in power. The CSA, bitter after defeat, find their scapegoat. . . .
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Books that I look
forward to when they come out later this year:
Quicksand: America’s Pursuit of Power in the Middle East
Geoffrey Wawro
America’s School for War: Fort Leavenworth, Officer Education, and Victory in World War II (Modern War Studies)
Peter J. Schifferle
Public Health and the Us Military: A History of the Army Medical Department, 1818-1917
Bobby A. Wintermute – I’d recommend everyone picking this one up, even at the steep price of $95. He’s my mentor.
No Higher Law: American Foreign Policy and the Western Hemisphere since 1776
Brian Loveman
At the Precipice: Americans North and South during the Secession Crisis (Littlefield History of the Civil War Era)
Shearer Davis Bowman
Empire for Liberty: A History of American Imperialism from Benjamin Franklin to Paul Wolfowitz
Richard H. Immerman
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
the Public Health one defintley seems intersting
After hearing the horror stories of Civlil war medincine and reading about early naval medince in Master and Commander series, it would be interesting to see the progression of medicine through the 19th century.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 10:29 AM MST up reply actions
It's a revision
of his dissertation.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
This thread reminds me, it must be time to re-read me some Machiavelli
My mum once got compared, by a judge in court, to Machiavelli. We were very proud.
(she was a witness btw, not the plaintiff)
This may be an odd question
but I am curious to the responses it gets.
What is the biggest “what-if” scenario of the 20th Century? That moment where things could have swung one direction, but a specific choice completely altered the timeline of history?
Attention Whore.
I'll go back to your first post.
What-if the victors of WWI decide to forgo punitive active, and instead try to rebuild their former enemies (via a Marshall-plan strategy)?
Does a Germany without crushing debt still turn to a Hitler? Do the united western powers alllow communism to rise in Russia (or are they more ripe for attempting it themselves)? Does Denver get a Continental League team in 1959?
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
Have you read The Plot Against America by Philip Roth?
It’s an alternate history novel that explores what happens when Charles Lindbergh (anti-Semite and isolationist) was elected president over FDR in 1940.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:51 AM MST up reply actions
In regards to the book or the scenario?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:54 AM MST up reply actions
The scenario
Just my little joke. Well, “joke”.
I was going to write a book about what might have happened if a crazed right-wing lunatic took over the UK, but then I realised that’s what happened in 1979.
Or could have
with Oswald Mosley.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Speaking of which
keep an eye on those BNP people over there, kay?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:57 AM MST up reply actions
I think we are, now
I don’t know if it made the news over there but the leader of the BNP appeared on Question Time, the pre-eminent politics panel discussion TV show, and came across as a shifty, sweating idiot.
Though also lately the BNP, who were forced to repeal their “whites only” membership policy, welcomed their first non-caucasian member, a Sikh pensioner.
Well I still read the UK news
so I heard all about that….
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:00 AM MST up reply actions
Most alternate history
writers don’t get the ripple effects of changing events. Even Harry Turtledove, PhD in Byzantine history, doesn’t handle it well, but when you do it for the money, who the hell cares. Right?
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
But the ripple very rapidly becomes utterly unpredicatbe AND all-encompassing
So you can only focus on the most interesting bits.
Well it's not the 20th century
But I think that the Battle of Hastings was a pretty big ’un.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:54 AM MST up reply actions
yes, yes it was.
but you don’t think William would have tried again if he had been forced to retreat?
Attention Whore.
oh hell yes William would have tried again
He didn’t get “Invictissimus” on his grave for nothing. I meant if they’d managed to get the arrow in his eye instead of Harold’s. (At one point of the battle, William was yanking his helmet off to prove he was still alive and get the fleeing Normans to turn around. This is a guy who it’s just a really bad idea to be on the other side from).
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 10:58 AM MST up reply actions
so less the battle of Hastings
and more William not getting an arrow in his eye like a madman.
Attention Whore.
The thing about William
is that he was just so damn good at what he did. Which was beating the crap out of people. He didn’t really lose a battle his entire life (until his last engagement which led to his death in 1087).
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:02 AM MST up reply actions
yeah I would put that one or Waterloo as the most impactful for all time
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:00 AM MST up reply actions
Yeah, Waterloo too, but I love the Norman Conquest
I am a Norman Conquest geek. It’s taking over my life. So I naturally think of that one first.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:01 AM MST up reply actions
also maybe Casear crossing the Rhine
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:02 AM MST up reply actions
As in, Hannibal of Carthage and the Alps?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:03 AM MST up reply actions
I'm not as familiar with the earlier eras
Was that during the Punic Wars?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:05 AM MST up reply actions
yeah
he was left to plunder the Roman countryside for years without supplies. Eventually, the Roman army counterattacked Carthage itself and Hannibal was forced to retreat and defend his homeland, where he was eventually defeated.
The shift in power and the real catalyst for the Roman Empire
Attention Whore.
And years later,
Carthago delenda est.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Yeah I haven't studied as much Antiquity history
One of these days I should give myself a refresher on the Roman Empire. The thing I tend to remember, of course, is all the crazy emperors.
Very strange fact: One night I had a dream that I was in some sort of history competition. I was asked who the first Christian Roman emperor was, and when. I said, “Constantine, 313 AD.”
And then I woke up and realized that it was correct. Hmmm.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:11 AM MST up reply actions
yeah me too obviously
after my Rhine comment
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:13 AM MST up reply actions
Stuff by Adrian Goldsworthy
http://www.adriangoldsworthy.com/books.htm
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
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I spend
much too much time looking through university press catalogs and the like.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
I don't blame you
the nice thing about my job is I spend half my day browsing through online journal resources
Attention Whore.
I'm still waiting
for the winter 2009/2010 issue of the Journal of Military History to be available through ProjectMuse.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
This won't be a problem
when I can actually join the SMH and SHAFR.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Society for Historians
of American Foreign Relations. They publish Diplomatic History.
Have a PhD in the area or be working toward one.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Well, technically
anyone interested in the subject can join, but you know.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Yes.
I’ve started to check out three-five books every week from the Queens Library system. It has a great collection.
I’ll be well prepared.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
First "Christian" emperor.
He wasn’t baptized until shortly before his death.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Commonly recognized as the first though
Which was apparently good enough for my subconscious.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:14 AM MST up reply actions
in hoc signo vinces
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
That was also the dream
where my subconscious correctly identified “Thursday” as coming from “Thor’s Day” after the Norse god. Which I hadn’t even looked up or anything prior to falling asleep and having said dream.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:18 AM MST up reply actions
I always refer to the days of the week
by their origins. Saturnday, Thorsday… Odinday is my favorite
Attention Whore.
What's your feeling about..
Humpday?
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If Hannibal hadn't lost half his army in crossing the Alps..
in October, then he wouldn’t have needed the support. He was also roundly defeated in Carthage by Scipio in a fairly even fight (Hannibal even had his war elephants).
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wandered around Rome for 15 years
too many troops to be pushed back, not enough to actually assault Rome proper.
Attention Whore.
The Rubicon?
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
right haha the Rhine where did that come from
brain malfunction
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:05 AM MST up reply actions
Which river did Attila the Hun cross before his big battle with the Romans?
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A great history of the Vatican II is called the Rhine flows into the Tiber
Belief that success is inevitable is as likely to hold you back as a belief that it is impossible.
this has nothing to do with history
but I once performed in a trilogy of plays entitled “The Norman Conquests”
Though the Norman it references was a british gentleman, and his conquests were not of a military nature…
Attention Whore.
I think I may have heard of that
Sounds… intriguing.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:04 AM MST up reply actions
it's quite funny
all 3 plays take place over the same night at the same house, but each play is located in a specific room in the house.
So in the first play, someone may walk into the kitchen laughing about something, but you don’t find out what it is until halfway through the second play, when you see the joke told in the living room.
Attention Whore.
Here's a vote for Cuban Missile Crisis...
None of us might exist if that goes differently.
The writer formerly known as Jabberwocky
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by Jeff Aberle on Feb 10, 2010 12:13 PM MST up reply actions
yeah aint that the truth
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 12:15 PM MST up reply actions
Good point
but doesn’t it look like there were plenty of mistakes made, yet none turned out fatal. Both sides were obviously HIGHLY motivated to insure it didn’t escalate out of control…
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
I don't know if this is number one
but I would say what if Japan decided not to attack Pearl Harbor when they did? This means that the US takes longer to get involved in the War and all of Europe including the UK possibly falls to Hitler while Japan captures even more land in the South Pacific. World War II might have a different ending if that happens.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:09 PM MST up reply actions
It certainly turned out that way for the US
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:31 PM MST up reply actions
I never understood Japan's reasoning for attacking Pearl Harbor..
although they attacked the Philippines at the same time for their oil reserves. So it leads to the question of if the US would go to war over the attack on MacArthur’s troops and the resulting Bataan death march if Pearl Harbor was never touched.
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I believe that FDR was looking for any reason to enter into the war
and the Japanese needed to make a move. Their island nation doesn’t have the resources necessary to maintain such a large military without expanding.
The idea behind Pearl Harbor was to completely cripple the Pacific Fleet, and they were successful. Like I said above, Japan was well ahead of the US in the Pacific until some incredibly bad luck at Midway Island. A few things swing the other way (planes arrive 10 minutes earlier at a carrier group) and the Japanese would have controlled the Pacific.
Attention Whore.
Well Japan was certainly bold..
attacking two American territories at the same time. However it was nothing more than a symbolic victory, half of the battleships were raised and refitted for later duty and the battle held no lasting victory for the Japanese.
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How about this for an interesting scenario
Japan wins Midway and gains control of the Pacific but the US still gets the A-Bomb in 1945.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 5:52 PM MST up reply actions
How would the Bomb be delivered to Japan?
Through the Aleutians?
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I just finished reading Children Of The Mind by Orson Scott Card
And he discusses this in the afterword. He thinks that the military and political leaders were pressured into attacking the US because of their perception of what the under-officers expected of them. He wonders what would have happened if they had not attacked – there was a lot of death and destruction rained down of Japan, but it ultimately led to them turning their culture towards Democracy and leading to the advancements to where they are today. It’s an interesting argument.
by controlled_slide on Feb 10, 2010 1:24 PM MST up reply actions
man the Enders Game books are great
I am reading Bean’s side now.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
yeah
there is a line that follows Ender and line that follows Bean
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ender%27s_Game_series#Ender_series
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
it will have to wait in line behind the Mars trilogy, unfortunately
and the 5 other books I am in the middle of currently
Attention Whore.
yeah I get that way too
right now I am reading Les Mis but want to finsih Master and Commander series, Enders Gmae Series and the Second David Eddings Series. Start the Turtledove series along with a lot of the books recomended today
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
The question I would have involving America's entry into the war is how late would have been too late?
How much more of the Pacific would Japan have had to control for this to happen? How strong wouls Hitler have gotten? I personally don’t think we could have waited much longer before to course of the war became irreverseable.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:36 PM MST up reply actions
well, the war was at a breaking point in the Pacific regardless of Pearl Harbor or not
Japan’s oil lines were being stretched thin and they had to start invading American bases to keep their armies mobile
Attention Whore.
Poking the bear still seems kind of stupid to me though
I know I have the advantage of knowing the outcome but the risk seems to outweigh the reward in this case.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:49 PM MST up reply actions
without some extreme luck at Midway
the Japanese would have held an extreme edge in the Pacific Theater for a couple more years at least. Perhaps even enough to sue for peace. They were never going to invade the US mainland.
Attention Whore.
there is a good book about this
called Japan’s War goes back way in history to show why Japan attacked.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
Well it's not the 20th century but what would have been the outcome of the American Civil War if
Stonewall Jackson hadn’t been shot by his own troops and Lee had taken Longstreet’s advice and elected not to fight at Gettysburg?
Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah, 1983
never mind. It's discussed below.
Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah, 1983
hmmm
canidates:
Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand
Sinking of the Lusitania
Treaty of Versailles
Midway
Aircraft Carriers not at Pearl Harbor
D-Day
Cuban Missle Crisis
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
reply fail once again
dang
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 10:43 AM MST up reply actions
crazy thing about Ferdinand
did you know that it was a complete fluke he died that day?
The original assassination attempt failed and the assassins scattered. Ferdinand ordered his party towards a hospital to take care of the wounded, but they happened down a side street where Princip was going into a cafe. Princip recognized the Archduke, charged the vehicle and shot.
(Apparently, Princip was also the worst shot of the group, commonly mocked during their target practice. The only way he could have hit anything was to get lucky.)
Attention Whore.
The Archduke was
also a vain man. He was sewn into his clothing, or so I’ve heard.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
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yeah it's a crazy story
the first attempt was actually a sticky bomb that just bounced off the car and into the crowd and Ferdinand wanted to go to the hospital to see the wounded.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 10:48 AM MST up reply actions
This is a good list
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:20 PM MST up reply actions
If we were doing the 19th century I would have a really good underdog candidate
January 24th 1848; the day gold was discoved in California. This obviously caused the gold rush but it also caused other things to happen. If forced California into statehood as a free state and elimated the Missouri comp line and put the country on the fast track to Civil War. The Civil War was bound to happen anyway, but this really helped accelerate it. Who knows how far slavery would have spread if we continued a slower progression westward. Basically I’m arguing that without the discovery of gold, the Civil War happens much later and this could have drastically altered American events in the 20th century.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:30 PM MST up reply actions
As much tension as there was between the north and south before this event
the Missouri comp line actually did a pretty good job of keeping war at bay. Popular Sovereignty was a complete disaster.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:41 PM MST up reply actions
I am currently reading a book about the Missouri Compromise
and I had no idea that the debate should have never even come up. A Junior Congressman decided to make a dramatic speech right before the end of Congress’ session and it became a national debate overnight.
If he wasn’t trying to stir up his base, or if Congress had remained in session for another week, the situation would have dissolved.
Attention Whore.
Wow that really intriguing
I love seeing how things like this that might seem so litte at one time explode into something huge.
Oh and while I’m remembering………… Happy Birthday Muzia!!!!!
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:52 PM MST up reply actions
The Missouri Compromise and Its Aftermath: Slavery and the Meaning of America by Robert Pierce Forbes?
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
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good guess, but no
I can’t remember the author right now. It’s about 1100 pages long though, I have been working my way through it 20 pages at a time for about a year now.
Attention Whore.
Ah, well,
I really like the titles the University of Kansas Press and the UNC Press put out. That’s why I come up with these titles.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
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something like
The Making of the American Democracy 1800-1830
The title is something close to that. The book is an absolute monster, therefore I am taking my time getting through it. I don’t really have a choice.
Attention Whore.
One work I need to pick up
is David M. Potter’s The Impending Crisis, a classic work on the 1850s.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
yeah this is a good one
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
awesome everyone's in here instead of the front page
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yeah it appears that a lot of Rox fans are also closet history nerds as well
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:27 AM MST up reply actions
We're out and proud
historinerds
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:33 AM MST up reply actions
yeah I guess thats true in my case too
my friends buy me posters like this 
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:35 AM MST up reply actions
I wish they would ask me..
Before using my pic like that. I get risiduals from the boxing shorts company.
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Yeah, we're not discussing
the seasons of all-time Rockies.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
clearly
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by Andrew Martin on Feb 10, 2010 11:32 AM MST up reply actions
It's snowing here.
I need something to entertain me.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
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Yeah I have a snowday
wiped out a 7am-5pm day. Woohoo.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:34 AM MST up reply actions
ok
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by Andrew Martin on Feb 10, 2010 11:34 AM MST up reply actions
Yeah RMN
what do YOU know about Gavrilo Princip?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:34 AM MST up reply actions
dick diddly dick
that’s why I write for a baseball website
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by Andrew Martin on Feb 10, 2010 11:35 AM MST up reply actions
Well,
we’re more than glad to move our discussion from here to your article.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
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do what you guys want
i was just wondering why the front page in general was so quiet
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by Andrew Martin on Feb 10, 2010 11:38 AM MST up reply actions
It was this
or have SnakePit Day here.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
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at least it'd be a baseball discussion
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by Andrew Martin on Feb 10, 2010 11:40 AM MST up reply actions
This is clearly marked as OT.
Are you planning a coup?
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
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I shouldn't need to
but like RdRunner said, I’m clearly just “pimping” my article, so I’ll just vote 1 and move on
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by Andrew Martin on Feb 10, 2010 11:47 AM MST up reply actions
Isn't that how you kids talk these days?
Oh, and get off my lawn!
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
Lemme guess
Rox Girl lost another bet?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:44 AM MST up reply actions
Yeah,
but I don’t know what the bet was.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
If you've read one RMN piece...
you’ve read them all!
j/k Now stop interupting us just to pimp your work.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
fair point
do continue
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by Andrew Martin on Feb 10, 2010 11:38 AM MST up reply actions
He didn't suck.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
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Damn it Russ
how dare you pre-empt me with vacuum jokes
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:37 AM MST up reply actions
Surely you can come up with something better.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
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Wha?
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:44 AM MST up reply actions
making a Hoover Dam joke
then realized you did one earlier, but perhaps it was unintentional?
Attention Whore.
Ohh
Yeah, that one must have been a little too subtle for me. Although I am attempting to write when not hanging around in this thread.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:47 AM MST up reply actions
I'm in the year 1060 by now
The plot thickens…
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:53 AM MST up reply actions
ha
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:37 AM MST up reply actions
I'll be the first to say it (and actually mean it)
I don’t think Hoover sucked. He was a very intelligent and qualified man, and should not be thrown on the same list as Harrison, Harding, Arthur, etc…
Attention Whore.
Willy or Benny?
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does it really matter?
I guess one didn’t have a chance to be prez, the other just wasn’t very good at it.
Attention Whore.
Harrison
Haha I was telling my roomate about him the other night. How he caught a cold during his inaugial address which is still the longest in history, then died two weeks later. Another crazy story.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:48 AM MST up reply actions
haha
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:50 AM MST up reply actions
I have come to the conclusion
that most people don’t know that a)Millard Fillmore was our 13th president and b)that Millard Fillmore was president.
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I can recite the 44 presidents in order
But I tend to almost always forget either Franklin Pierce or Millard Fillmore.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:54 AM MST up reply actions
Nah, Fillmore and Pierce
are the hardest ones to remember. But I occasionally go to a bar called Fillmore’s.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
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Yeah exactly
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 12:08 PM MST up reply actions
Both in terms of memorization and how much they sucked
Although I did like James K Polk
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:16 PM MST up reply actions
He may have been the closest of any president to actually do what he said he was going to do
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:43 PM MST up reply actions
which is why I love him.
Here are the four things I am going to do as President.
/gets elected
/completes everything he said in four years.
Love the guy.
Attention Whore.
So does he rank #1 for you in best presidents?
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:46 PM MST up reply actions
well, no
because he also was an extreme expansionist, and a land grabber.
But he did exactly what he said and is underrated.
And without him, I may not be a US citizen…
Attention Whore.
Agree
I think he has to rank pretty high though. One thing that I find funny about who we think of when we talk about our greatest presidents is that all of them had some sort of crisis to deal with. It’s kind of unfair to be marked down if you don’t have a crisis so I like to rank people like Polk very high.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:54 PM MST up reply actions
well, Texas could have been a crisis
same with the Mexican War. Either way, he handled himself admirably and you have to respect the man.
Even the things I dislike were more a product of the era than a judgement of the man himself. He is in my Top 5, most likely.
Attention Whore.
along this same line
who would be your dark horse Top 5 President and why?
Excluding Lincoln, Washington, FDR
Attention Whore.
Truman, for one.
While parochial in nature, he was sort of prescient about the nature and eventual end of the Cold War.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
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Taft belongs on this list as well
half of the things people credit Teddy with accomplishing actually occurred under Taft’s watch.
Attention Whore.
Isn't he also the reason we have a 7th inning stretch?
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 3:57 PM MST up reply actions
Speaking of Teddy...
Has anyone seen this? It’s caught my eye a couple of times, but haven’t seen it and am wondering what people thought.
Side note: I really need to get back to Yellowstone one of these days.
Great series.
You have to watch it in HD though.
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Reagan..
for ending the Cold War.
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Reagan
ended the Cold War as much as the Rockies won the Series in 07 and 09.
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by Russ Oates on Feb 10, 2010 4:52 PM MST via mobile up reply actions
He was the first leader to negotiate..
nuclear arms reduction.
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while simultaneously funneling money to splinter terrorist groups
and enlarging the military budget to unsustainable levels.
None of which ended the Cold War. Gorbachev was 100x the factor in ending the Cold War than Reagan.
You might as well say we have high gas prices because of Jimmy Carter.
Attention Whore.
Reagan enlarged the military budget..
to place America in a position of strength whereby the US could negotiate on level terms with the Russians. None of the Soviet leaders were willing to negotiate until the Americans proved they were a threat, which occurred when the Pershing 2 missiles were shipped to Europe. His most brilliant move was inventing a weapons system that completely terrified the Russians and wasn’t even close to production.
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Except
the Soviets never measured up to the US in any capacity.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
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Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Oh Really?

Between 1975 and 1980 America’s inventory of nukes dropped by around 3,000 and Russian inventories increased by over 10,000. Nearly double previous levels and really Reagan never reached pre1975 levels, he just continued an upward plateau to keep the playing field level.
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Stockpiles
are not the same thing as capacity. Besides, nukes were never a viable weapon of war nor a useful deterrent.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
by Russ Oates on Feb 10, 2010 9:12 PM MST via mobile up reply actions
But they were an effective cover
to increase military spending and cut social services, all in the name of “winning the Cold War”
Reagan wouldn’t make my Top 5. In fact, he would make my Bottom 10 to be sure. The man was a puppet and a disastrously harmful one as well.
Attention Whore.
I think your list of presidents would be really close to mine
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 11, 2010 10:20 AM MST up reply actions
Explain how he would be in your bottom..
Because I’m not buying it. He toppled a world super power without firing a shot and ushered in one of the most prosperous times in American history.
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He tripled the national debt in a span of 3 years
ushered in an era where the top 5% saw overwhelming prosperity, but the poverty rate jumped to Depression-era levels.
He didn’t do a damn thing to end the Cold War. Because he was president when it toppled doesn’t mean it wasn’t already toppling before he accomplished anything.
His administration was corrupt and had no qualms declaring a “war on drugs” and then using drug cartels to funnel money and arms.
I would continue, but why should I name other abuses that the man himself “cannot recall”. He was a figurehead, a puppet, and the single worst thing for minorities in this country since Jim Crow.
Attention Whore.
by Muzia on Feb 11, 2010 12:40 PM MST up reply actions 1 recs
You and Russ are overlooking how strong the Soviets were..
They’re economy prospered when oil prices were up while the US economy suffered. The USSR was fighting a war on several fronts to undermine America. Without Reagan, and the death of Premier Breszchev to be honest, the world would be a different place today. Also the national debt was nowhere near FDR or even current levels.
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Nope.
Soviets done in by Gorbachev’s willingness to alter system. Ultimately, what he did was bring it down.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
You can blame the debt on Nixon taking us off of the gold standard.
The writer formerly known as Jabberwocky
READ and LEARN about the business of baseball at Purple Row Academy
Eschew Obfuscation!
I wonder if you can come up with another example...
where one side of the conflict (and the losing side at that)was “100x” nore responsible for ending the conflict than the other. Was Nixon 100x more responsible for the US defeat in VietNam than Ho Chi Mihn? Was Napolean 100x the factor in losing Waterloo than Wellington?
Not being a Marxist, I don’t have much use for historical determinism. The collapse of communism was not inevitable, except in the sense that nothing lasts forever. It certainly wasn’t expected to collapse in my lifetime.
Ignorance of the American League is a sign of good moral character.
Look out Dodgers...Purple objects in mirror are closer than they appear.
Since we're on the topic of Reagan..
have you guys heard the story about how Reagan’s security council discovered the Soviets were stealing American technology and sabotaged it causing the Siberian Oil pipeline to explode! It’s known as the Farewell Dossier.
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The collapse of the USSR was inevitable
and had been since the middle of Brezhnev. There were warning signs for at least 15 years before the fall of the Berlin Wall. All of the old guard was dying off and the younger generations didn’t want more of the same.
The rate at which the government collapsed is absolutely stunning, however, and we still can’t comprehend everything that occurred.
Attention Whore.
I don't know that he ended the
Cold War but I will say that he rallied this country at a time when it was pretty down. Blaming him for the invention of crack cocaine and the subsequent destruction of the black community seems a little unfair as it would just as likely have happened on anyone’s watch. The true value of Reagan will be known in time as the emotional attachment fades, but I do think that the same pundits who accuse the latest protesters of being racially motivated are either forgetting the backlash that Reagan and Thatcher dealt with or are being intellectually dishonest
Belief that success is inevitable is as likely to hold you back as a belief that it is impossible.
When I was in 4th grade
my teacher taught is a rhyme or chant to remember all the presidents in order, using shortened versions of their last names. I can now only remember it through the first 13. But I’ve got those 13 down cold.
Wash Ad Jeff Mad Mon Ad Jack, Van Har Ty, Po Tay Fill.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:45 PM MST up reply actions
What geniuses the Animaniacs were
They also will help you remember the US Capitols and the Countries of the World. I laugh so hard when I watch these.
by controlled_slide on Feb 10, 2010 1:56 PM MST up reply actions
The countries one is incredable
(Although they never mention South Africa)
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 2:04 PM MST up reply actions
There are a few countries he doesn't mention
But it’s brilliant and hilarious nonetheless.
by controlled_slide on Feb 10, 2010 2:05 PM MST up reply actions
The last verse is awesome
You hear the first couple and you’re like “I can learn that” and then the last verse comes and you just start laughing.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 2:11 PM MST up reply actions
I never realised how radical Animaniacs was
But naming Tibet, Palestine and, uh, Transylvania as separate countries was clearly a powerful act of political subterfuge.
Funny thing about Chester A. Arthur
Arthur’s primary achievement was the passage of the Pendleton Civil Service Reform Act. Nothing else really
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:55 AM MST up reply actions
true
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 11:57 AM MST up reply actions
I prefer
the look James G. Blaine had. Always wonder what he’d have done as president.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
kind of Lee/Grant look
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 12:00 PM MST up reply actions
Okay Muzia
So give us your impassioned defense of Hoover.
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 11:54 AM MST up reply actions
well
he was a very intelligent man who saved Europe from starvation during and after the Great War. His tireless public service saved tens of millions of lives.
His downfall was twofold (neither one of which was really his fault). He was elected President with no previous electoral experience and very little political acumen. He was elected President on the verge of a worldwide economic (and in the United States, ecological) crisis. Most people blame him for allowing the Depression to reach such depths, but there was no precedent for any leader to take major steps, therefore how was he to blame?
Without Hoover, FDR would not stand out as one of our greatest presidents. Hoover’s inability to act in an original manner was his downfall, not necessarily because of anything he did as president.
He does not belong on a list of worst presidents. He was just a very smart man with little experience in way over his (and everyone else’s) head.
Attention Whore.
We'd like to thank you Herbert Hooooover...
for really showing us the way….
I can haz NL West title in 2010? And for that matter, the damn 2010 season to START?
by Silverblood on Feb 10, 2010 12:07 PM MST up reply actions
One of my favorite quotes about Hoover was from Babe Ruth when his salary was high than the president's
When asked if he should be making more money than the president, Ruth replied “I think so, I had a better year than he did”
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:19 PM MST up reply actions
Well I don't think he was as bad as lets say
James Buchanon.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 10, 2010 1:14 PM MST up reply actions
I've also done
this: http://qcpages.qc.edu/history/wwiiveterans/index.html
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
Nice
you have some html skills to go along with the history
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
by RockiesDave on Feb 10, 2010 12:14 PM MST up reply actions
Should've explained a bit more.
I did most of the research that went into the website. I didn’t build the website. I do know a bit of HTML. Back before we had this version of PR, I did plenty of coding.
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
I helped with a similar project here at CU
when I worked in the University Archives, I assisted on the Japanese Language School project. During World War II, CU was home to the Naval School for Japanese translators, taught them the basics of the language in order to intercept and translate radio messages. It appears our projects were very similar.
Attention Whore.
History Of Poland
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
Show-off
and nerd
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Feb 10, 2010 2:19 PM MST reply actions
Thank you.
/bows
"Shall it be peace, or a sword?" - Excised line from Lincoln's First Inaugural Address
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Diplomatic and Military History Book Review - My other blog where I go all historical on you.
I did that same debate in high school...do you go to Poudre?
And the answer is no—not that you can prove anyway. Purely selfish is too exclusionary.
The writer formerly known as Jabberwocky
READ and LEARN about the business of baseball at Purple Row Academy
Eschew Obfuscation!
by Jeff Aberle on Feb 10, 2010 10:26 PM MST up reply actions
Where's the Civil War discussion around here?
Here’s a question:
Was Lee wrong to order Pickett’s charge at the battle of Gettysburg?
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Should of listened to Longstreet
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
I think if Stonewall had still been alive he would of agreed with Longstreet
Together they might of been able to convince Lee to either redeploy or attack around to the right. That said though there was also alot of pressure on Lee to destroy the union army itself rather than to try to get to Washington.
Dex Knows
Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. -C.S. Lewis
I agree I think Lee knew that he was closing in on a win or die situation
I think his early success at getting the Union soldiers or more accurately their Generals to blink had colored his judgment.
Belief that success is inevitable is as likely to hold you back as a belief that it is impossible.
Stonewall was arguably the greatest battlefield commander the U.S. has ever produced.
Approached only by George Patton and U.S. Grant IMO.
Shelby Foote is quoted as saying something to the effect that Gettysburg was the price the South had to pay for having Lee as commander.
The combination of defeat at Gettysburg and Vicksburg on the same day and the elevation of U.S. Grant to command of the Union forces is what finished off the South.
Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah, 1983
Lee had to attack with Pickett's men at Gettysburg..
Gettysburg can be compared to Washington’s battle of Trenton. The south needed a victory on northern soil to bring Frances or Britain in as an ally. Washington’s victory at Trenton led to French funding and arms sales and ultimately independence. If Lee had won at Gettysburg the CSA might have won the war.
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Hey why is TDR's The Naval War of 1812 not on this list?
or for that matter Winston Churchhill’s histories? this list is leaning a bit and may topple completely with even one more Chomsky addition
Belief that success is inevitable is as likely to hold you back as a belief that it is impossible.
Happy Birthday Mr Abraham Lincoln!
I can honestly say you were my favorite president. It’s a shame you weren’t allowed to finish your work on this earth.
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by Charlie77 on Feb 12, 2010 12:46 PM MST via mobile reply actions
I actually think his plan of reconstruction was too lenient
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 12, 2010 1:30 PM MST up reply actions
I think segregation might still exist today if Lincoln got his way
That 14th amendment is pretty key.
"I'm convinced that every boy, in his heart, would rather steal second base than an automobile." ~Tom Clark
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Feb 12, 2010 2:50 PM MST up reply actions
it's a fascinating argument
what would have happened if there was a strong leader in the Executive keeping the fiery Republican Congress in line? Would the South have kept along a similar path? Segregation never really disappeared, it just submerged for the 15 years of Reconstruction and once the Southern states were in charge of their own congresses again, it became commonplace once again. You could make a very persuasive argument.
Attention Whore.

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