Friday Morning Rockpile: Problems

by Russ Oates on Nov 16, 2007 8:46 AM MST in Rockpile

Barry Lamar Bonds indicted on charges of perjury and obstruction of justice.
Derek Jeter reportedly owes back taxes to New York.
Rockies lose starting catcher, possibly 2nd baseman.
And the winner is?

OK, Bonds's indictment is bad news for the entire MLB and Derek Jeter possibly owing taxes is funny, but the third item is of more importance to the Rockies (since, you know, it involves them). By only offering a vesting option instead of a guaranteed third year, the Rockies lost Torrealba to the Mets. Time to move on . . . and also lose Matsui to the Cubs to a similar contract. Second base has more internal options to fill that hole (Carroll, Nix, Stewart, and possibly Baker) than looking to the market.

Tracy Ringolsby has a few more names to look at for catcher in addition to the regular three. But before getting to those names, read that line about the offers Lo Duca, Barrett, and Kendall might receive from the Rockies. The offers won't even reach the level offered to Torrealba. On the one hand, it won't be that great of a financial risk and because of their ages a long-term contract really wouldn't a question. Still, there's something telling me that it'll take a hard sell to get one of them here.

Don't sign one of them and that leaves the Rockies with Iannetta and the search for his backup. I'll use backup in a very loose sense since we really have no idea what to expect out of Iannetta in 2008. 37-year-old Damian Miller, 33-year-old Jason LaRue, and 31-year-old Rod Barajas each have a history of catching 100+ games should they be called upon to do so. This seems to be the riskier course. If Iannetta doesn't show any improvement, any of the three guys mentioned here will have to step in for an extended period of time. If I had to choose out of three, I'd hope for Barajas to do something more like 2004 or 2005. Any good catchers available on the FA market after 2008?

Tweet Comment 17 comments | 0 recs |

Do you like this story?

Comments

Estrada

An interesting note in Ringolsby's piece is the possibility of Johnny Estrada being nontendered by the Brewers, who are targeting Jason kendall.

Estrada played hurt last season, with a bone spur in his throwing elbow, and it impacted him at the plate and behind it. He couldn't throw anyone out.

But, he's had surgery to fix the elbow and should be ready for spring training. he's 31 and a proven performer when healthy.

If he comes fairly cheaply, he's absolutely worth a look, don't you think?

Here's the piece about his health problems and outlook for next season:

Estrada is an interesting name

Part of the Brewers non-tendering, is Estrada has/had a pretty healthy contract. He's a risk for sure but maybe worth a look. I also like LaRue. He's had some pop with hitting Home Runs (though most of that was while in Cincinnati)

My bigger concern is 2nd base. We lose Matsui and we got nothing. Carroll, Barmes, Quintinella? none are playoff team 2nd basemen. Hell, I don't think they are MLB 2nd basemen. The Cubs threw big money last off season to De Rosa, who was a bust. I expected Matsui to get about $5 a year. That's about right for a good starter in today's era. 3 years? That was what I figured he'd get as well, as most teams would drop out after a 2 year contract. I have no problem with the Rockies matching this contract, as we have to have Matsui back.

I miss baseball. Chairman of the re-sign Kazuo Matsui sub-committee!

by Redhawk on Nov 16, 2007 10:22 AM MST up reply actions

But there's the thing...

Carroll, Barmes, and Omar Q WON'T be playing 2nd base, God willing. We have plenty of internal options at 2nd, and one of them HAS to be willing to step up and play at the level we expect. Also, Hurdle has to be willing to take a risk on the younger player instead of the grizzled veteran. There's where your concern is very valid. If/when we lose our Kaz-Mat sparkplug, and we only replace him with those names listed above, then we are in big trouble.

by oo_nrb on Nov 16, 2007 11:01 AM MST up reply actions

Options

I'm not sure how much of a legitimate option Stewart or Baker are at 2nd. (I completely throw out Nix cause I couldn't stand his over hyped bust of a brother Lance Nix when he came through the Rangers organization) Also not sure how either will hit on an everyday basis, though they could both hit better then most 2ndbasemen. Baker is built more like a typical 2ndbaseman then Stewart. If the Rockies or some scouting said, they looked great in picking up the position, I'd be more comfortable I guess.

I know neither will run like Kaz on the base paths. Losing Kaz would make Tavares even more a key piece, as he will be our only real speed guy, and I'm not sold on his hitting, especially with out bunting. He's also had issues with staying healthy.

Castillo, recently of the Mets is the only other option at 2nd on the FA market worth looking at, and he's slowing down. Felipe Lopez in trade might be interesting. Iguchi seems to me to be a very poor man's Matsui.

I miss baseball. Chairman of the re-sign Kazuo Matsui sub-committee!

by Redhawk on Nov 16, 2007 11:25 AM MST up reply actions

Problem with Iguchi

I really like him...but he's not worth the Type A compensation that hey'll require.

by sg8335aa on Nov 16, 2007 11:59 AM MST up reply actions

There's a clause

in his contract that says he needs to be released by the team if a new deal is not reached in 2007, meaning he can't be offered arbitration. Hideki Matsui had a similar clause a few years ago when his original deal ended.

I haven't found an article yet, only a mention on Rotoworld, that the Phillies released Iguchi today. I believe that means he doesn't require compensation anymore, if he ever carried some in the first place.

"Don't give up the ship!" - Capt. James Lawrence

by Russ Oates on Nov 16, 2007 2:14 PM MST up reply actions

Here's

the MLB.com article on Iguchi's realease and lack of compensation.

"Don't give up the ship!" - Capt. James Lawrence

by Russ Oates on Nov 16, 2007 2:25 PM MST up reply actions

Well, yes

Ideally I'd love to see Kaz in purple again, especially at the top of our lineup. Good point about Taveras being our only speedster if Kaz leaves, as well.

by oo_nrb on Nov 16, 2007 2:36 PM MST up reply actions

Estrada

Now that's an intriguing name. If he is healthy and motivated, he's an upgrade in tangibles over Yorvi. It's a big if, but if he's available he'll quickly jump up my list of desirable backstops. When healthy, he's decent at controlling the basepaths, he's definitely a better bat, so I'm thinking if he's non-tendered it wouldn't hurt to take a swing at him.

President of the Kazuo Matsui Fan Club

by MattTheRock on Nov 16, 2007 10:45 AM MST up reply actions

Estrada

I was watching a Brewers game late in the season and the opposing team's analyst quoted a scout he'd talked to about Estrada. The scout said, "He gets fatter and lazier every time I see him." Weak defense, injury issues, weight issues, attitude issues. Not a fit.

Seems to me a LoDuca/Ianetta combo would work pretty well. LoDuca's a hustling, competitive, wants-to-win player, and better offensively than Torrealba or certainly Kendall. His % of runners caught stealing wasn't great, but it was better than Torrealba's.

LoDuca's problem is age & durability. He shouldn't be a fulltime catcher, or even close to it, anymore. Give him 90-100 games, with no day games after night games, replacement in extra innings, days off in hot parks mid-summer. Give Ianetta 60-70 games, which lowers the pressure on Ianetta as THE catcher. It's a tough position to break into at the ML level. Let him do it gradually.

One of the Rockies' strengths this year was team chemistry. If you don't think that's important, look at the Dodgers. An Estrada or Barrett isn't a good addition in that respect. LoDuca would be -- he'd fit right in. A 2-year deal with a vesting option seems like it ought to work.

by strosnrocks on Nov 16, 2007 9:40 AM MST reply actions

Iannetta

I guess for the sake of argument I'll have to quibble with the idea that "we have no idea what to expect out of Iannetta in 2008."

Unless we believe that minor league performance is in no way indicative of major league potential, we do have plenty of reason based on his minor league record to believe that Iannetta can be a productive major leaguer - but here's the kicker - if given sufficient time to make the necessary adjustments.

Iannetta is admittedly not on the same talent scale, but if you look at the radically different way that two comparable prospects from last year - 3B Alex Gordon and Ryan Braun - adjusted to the MLB you can see it takes different guys different amounts of time. Braun needed basically zero adjustment time. Gordon came out flailing. The Royals stuck with Gordon through his growing pains and were rewarded with a solid last 1/3 of the season from him and have every reason to think he will be productive for many years to come.

Will the Rockies have the intestinal fortitude to stick Iannetta out there for 450 AB? I don't know, but the temptation to have a veteran start over a promising youngster is just the kind of thing that is killing the Dodgers and that the Rockies need to be smart enough to avoid.

by FI2 on Nov 16, 2007 11:59 AM MST reply actions

I absolutely agree with you.

I just like to play an internal taras-chi some times. Someone got that reference when I first made it back in April.

"Don't give up the ship!" - Capt. James Lawrence

by Russ Oates on Nov 16, 2007 1:47 PM MST up reply actions

iannetta

part of this is that the rox are gunshy at the catcher's postion. they've seen one young prospect after another -- owens, petrick, closser, etc. -- crash and burn, so perhaps they expect the same thing here.

that may not be fair to iannetta, but it's reality.

by BroJB @ Purple Row on Nov 16, 2007 2:09 PM MST up reply actions

Seriously, though

I'll consider not being a Rockies fan if the team does something stupid, like sign one of the catchers they've mentioned. Jason Kendall? I don't see how Iannetta can be worse than him. Michael Barrett? Huh, I guess we should give our pitchers a set of boxing gloves.

http://mvn.com/mlb-rockies: The best thing to happen to baseball since 1993.

by Rox Fan in TN on Nov 17, 2007 12:17 PM MST up reply actions

Laughable

"I'll consider not being a Rockies fan if the team does something stupid..."

Professional sports must be rough for you. Who's left to root for? I'm pretty sure they've ALL done something stupid recently.

It's tough to say who to go with. If we DON'T pursue a catcher, we're looking at a Iannetta/Bellorin combo. If not that, just slate some FA veteran into the backup slot, such as Danny Ardoin was in '06.

And then what do we do if Iannetta isn't shaking it? I don't mean like a month, but what if after 150AB he's hitting .197 still? You can't have a sub .220 hitter in your lineup and call yourself a contending team. Hell, a sub .250 hitter, really.

Point is, it's a risk. He looks to be sort of ready. We either waste money on a potential feast or famine, or we spend minimum on Iannetta for the same.

It's Tricky to rock a rhyme, to rock a rhyme that's right on time It's Tulowitzki!...Tulo-witzki-witzki-witzki ..... rockiesmagicnumber.blogspot.com

by Andrew Martin on Nov 17, 2007 1:43 PM MST up reply actions

Personally

I'd be fine with giving Bellorian a chance to try and be a passable MLB catcher. If the alternative is the current crop of free agent catchers, then there's not too many compelling arguments for them. We might be able to replace Yorvi's numbers, but with someone who will cost more and is going to be paid to get worse over the span of the deal.

I think the biggest caveat to this is the organization's opinion of Ianetta. If they truly believe that he is ready to handle a full-time load, the we should probably be looking for someone who is expecting to be a backup and doesn't harbor any illusions of a starting role. I'd hate to see us tie up money that should be used in other places for an aging declining catcher.

President of the Kazuo Matsui Fan Club

by MattTheRock on Nov 17, 2007 2:39 PM MST up reply actions

Joking

It's a strong way of saying "yeah, let's not do this." Whatever we pay for any of those three means that either Iannetta's not going to be the starter, or we're going to be paying a hell of a lot of money for a backup catcher.

http://mvn.com/mlb-rockies: The best thing to happen to baseball since 1993.

by Rox Fan in TN on Nov 17, 2007 5:26 PM MST up reply actions